If the Bears roll with Fields this year there is no reason we can't have MHJ and also Newton at 3-tech - and with a very tiny trade down we could harvest another 1st round draft pick for 2025 if Fields doesn't pan out this year as our franchise QB. That's my preference but I get it that the Bears may draft a QB and that may mean we don't get one of the top WRs in this draft.
yeah, that's how I see it too. And that's why I want Fields to work out. Get him a good OC, good QB coach, a better OL and NHJ and then no excuses. Problem is, if I am wrong and he is not the guy, we blew past the 1st pick and then can't fix it any more. Mind grating decision
I'm having some serious angst over this too. But I am a bit leary about Williams' emotional makeup for the Bears gid (and admit that I may be completely wrong on him), and Maye has areas of his game that I wonder about... and again maybe I'm worrying over nothing. I'm thinking we may have a better QB in next year's draft... worst case next year we may be able to package our 2 first round picks to get the guy who is best for us at QB. And best case is that Fields does work out for us and we have 2 more 1st round draft picks NEXT year too. I think it may be the safest route with the least risk. Fields' floor may be higher than both Caleb & Maye's ceiling... but time will tell.
yeah, that's how I see it too. And that's why I want Fields to work out. Get him a good OC, good QB coach, a better OL and NHJ and then no excuses. Problem is, if I am wrong and he is not the guy, we blew past the 1st pick and then can't fix it any more. Mind grating decision
Wanting JF to work out doesnt make it happen. I wanted it badly too. His 4th quarter is so horrendous, I don't want to experience another one ever again.
I put a lot of that 4th qtr stuff on horrific play-calling (we didn't have an NFL-quality play-caller this year)... it boggles the mind how bad some of those play calls were... no way they were going to help us. The OL was busy killing drives in the 4th quarter with stupid penalties... just broke our back with drive-killing mistakes by the OL. And then the stone-hand boys dropping passes in critical moments happened too. I just can't blame Fields for all of that. Did he make mistakes too? Sure. But Caleb would not have done one bit better (and probably worse) if he had been in those situations. At least Fields DID make some plays out of nothing there. Fields really has not had a coach since he came to the NFL. I'd like to see this guy perform with real legit coaching/play-calling, an OL that isn't crapping the bed (an NFL-quality C anchoring the IOL instead of the turnstile boys) and WRs (excluding DJ) who are not a dumpster fire.
If Caleb couldn't keep from crapping the beg against college D's like ND and USC, then he'd be a bug hitting a windshield under the conditions Fields had here so far.
yeah, that's how I see it too. And that's why I want Fields to work out. Get him a good OC, good QB coach, a better OL and NHJ and then no excuses. Problem is, if I am wrong and he is not the guy, we blew past the 1st pick and then can't fix it any more. Mind grating decision
I'm having some serious angst over this too. But I am a bit leary about Williams' emotional makeup for the Bears gid (and admit that I may be completely wrong on him), and Maye has areas of his game that I wonder about... and again maybe I'm worrying over nothing. I'm thinking we may have a better QB in next year's draft... worst case next year we may be able to package our 2 first round picks to get the guy who is best for us at QB. And best case is that Fields does work out for us and we have 2 more 1st round draft picks NEXT year too. I think it may be the safest route with the least risk. Fields' floor may be higher than both Caleb & Maye's ceiling... but time will tell.
This is where I am. I have nothing against Williams. But I'd rather trade down to get another first next year and take the best two players Poles can draft with where ever the picks end up. WR + EDGE or WT + Best DT would interest me. With Fields I think what we have seen is what we are going to get, maybe--maybe a slight increase with a better WR and OL in front of him.
As the draft rolls around teams will become more willing to trade as they mock things out internally and FAs sign. Where Cousins ends up could impact the top of the draft greatly. If Poles could get a 2024 first + 2025 first + a player (doesn't need to be a Moore type player could just be a young starting G or S) I'd be willing to roll with Fields one more year.
Again, before the non-readers jump me, I don't think Fields is going to suddenly turn it around. I'd be surprised if he even got to 3,500 yards passing. But, I'd be willing to team build first and then drop a QB in.
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If Poles thinks Williams is the man, draft him. No problems.
yeah, that's how I see it too. And that's why I want Fields to work out. Get him a good OC, good QB coach, a better OL and NHJ and then no excuses. Problem is, if I am wrong and he is not the guy, we blew past the 1st pick and then can't fix it any more. Mind grating decision
I'm having some serious angst over this too. But I am a bit leary about Williams' emotional makeup for the Bears gid (and admit that I may be completely wrong on him), and Maye has areas of his game that I wonder about... and again maybe I'm worrying over nothing. I'm thinking we may have a better QB in next year's draft... worst case next year we may be able to package our 2 first round picks to get the guy who is best for us at QB. And best case is that Fields does work out for us and we have 2 more 1st round draft picks NEXT year too. I think it may be the safest route with the least risk. Fields' floor may be higher than both Caleb & Maye's ceiling... but time will tell.
This Caleb stuff is gonna come down to his interviews and the interviews they do with his coaches, etc.
From what I have read, the "emotional immaturity" rap is way overdone. I think that will end up being much ado about nothing. His tape and skillset are top-notch.
When you look at that list of #1 QBs, there's 5-6 that were "consensus #1s head and shoulders above the rest" Names like Manning, Luck, Lawrence, Burrow, Stafford, etc. These guys were all "no doubt #1 picks" like Caleb is. That subset is pretty impressive. No guarantees of success of course, but the odds seem very much in your favor.
No offense, but your statement in bold makes little sense to me. Fields' floor is a backup QB. He's gonna get another chance to start somewhere else and probably 2 more seasons (someone will enact his 5th yr option) and after that he's gonna be demoted to backup status if he can't show substantial improvement. His passer career rating is the same as Mitch for crying out loud so he has a LONG way to go to get to "franchise starter". I'm quite confident that Caleb's ceiling is higher than Fields' floor...by a very large margin.
Sam Darnold was traded for a 2nd and a 4th. Josh Rosen was traded for a 2nd. What do you think Fields will bring in trade? Probably a 2nd +/- a sweetener. That should tell you what the rest of the NFL thinks of his ceiling and his floor.
I'm having some serious angst over this too. But I am a bit leary about Williams' emotional makeup for the Bears gid (and admit that I may be completely wrong on him), and Maye has areas of his game that I wonder about... and again maybe I'm worrying over nothing. I'm thinking we may have a better QB in next year's draft... worst case next year we may be able to package our 2 first round picks to get the guy who is best for us at QB. And best case is that Fields does work out for us and we have 2 more 1st round draft picks NEXT year too. I think it may be the safest route with the least risk. Fields' floor may be higher than both Caleb & Maye's ceiling... but time will tell.
This Caleb stuff is gonna come down to his interviews and the interviews they do with his coaches, etc.
From what I have read, the "emotional immaturity" rap is way overdone. I think that will end up being much ado about nothing. His tape and skillset are top-notch.
When you look at that list of #1 QBs, there's 5-6 that were "consensus #1s head and shoulders above the rest" Names like Manning, Luck, Lawrence, Burrow, Stafford, etc. These guys were all "no doubt #1 picks" like Caleb is. That subset is pretty impressive. No guarantees of success of course, but the odds seem very much in your favor.
No offense, but your statement in bold makes little sense to me. Fields' floor is a backup QB. He's gonna get another chance to start somewhere else and probably 2 more seasons (someone will enact his 5th yr option) and after that he's gonna be demoted to backup status if he can't show substantial improvement. His passer career rating is the same as Mitch for crying out loud so he has a LONG way to go to get to "franchise starter". I'm quite confident that Caleb's ceiling is higher than Fields' floor...by a very large margin.
Sam Darnold was traded for a 2nd and a 4th. Josh Rosen was traded for a 2nd. What do you think Fields will bring in trade? Probably a 2nd +/- a sweetener. That should tell you what the rest of the NFL thinks of his ceiling and his floor.
Yeah, we will just have to watch what happens with Fields. No argument from me about his numbers so far. I just see his floor as much higher than what the Bears have gotten out of him to date. Much higher. But I admit I may be wrong. But I would like to watch what he does with an NFL coach (his first on offense) and a better OL. And a better WR unit too. I love DJ but the Velus Jones, Mooney and other wannabees need upgrading - at least upgrade one more player in the WR room with legit talent. And I want that even if we do draft Caleb or Maye or whomever in this draft. Get a legit coach on offense. Upgrade the players there too. The Bears have the resources to do just that this year. No matter who the QB is this year (Fields or a rookie or a veteran FA) that guy is stepping into a better situation than Fields did.
This Caleb stuff is gonna come down to his interviews and the interviews they do with his coaches, etc.
From what I have read, the "emotional immaturity" rap is way overdone. I think that will end up being much ado about nothing. His tape and skillset are top-notch.
When you look at that list of #1 QBs, there's 5-6 that were "consensus #1s head and shoulders above the rest" Names like Manning, Luck, Lawrence, Burrow, Stafford, etc. These guys were all "no doubt #1 picks" like Caleb is. That subset is pretty impressive. No guarantees of success of course, but the odds seem very much in your favor.
No offense, but your statement in bold makes little sense to me. Fields' floor is a backup QB. He's gonna get another chance to start somewhere else and probably 2 more seasons (someone will enact his 5th yr option) and after that he's gonna be demoted to backup status if he can't show substantial improvement. His passer career rating is the same as Mitch for crying out loud so he has a LONG way to go to get to "franchise starter". I'm quite confident that Caleb's ceiling is higher than Fields' floor...by a very large margin.
Sam Darnold was traded for a 2nd and a 4th. Josh Rosen was traded for a 2nd. What do you think Fields will bring in trade? Probably a 2nd +/- a sweetener. That should tell you what the rest of the NFL thinks of his ceiling and his floor.
Yeah, we will just have to watch what happens with Fields. No argument from me about his numbers so far. I just see his floor as much higher than what the Bears have gotten out of him to date. Much higher. But I admit I may be wrong. But I would like to watch what he does with an NFL coach (his first on offense) and a better OL. And a better WR unit too. I love DJ but the Velus Jones, Mooney and other wannabees need upgrading - at least upgrade one more player in the WR room with legit talent. And I want that even if we do draft Caleb or Maye or whomever in this draft. Get a legit coach on offense. Upgrade the players there too. The Bears have the resources to do just that this year. No matter who the QB is this year (Fields or a rookie or a veteran FA) that guy is stepping into a better situation than Fields did.
With 3 years and 40 games already in the books, by definition his floor cannot be higher than what we have already seen. That's what floor means. We have seen some truly awful games from Fields both this season and last--his FLOOR cannot be higher than that cuz he's already shown that. We aren't talking about about one or two tough outings as a rookie here. We have seen him go long stretches of time in 2022 & 2023 struggling to reach 200 yards in games.
His floor is as a backup.
If he gets traded like I suspect he will, it will likely be to someone like Tennessee, NE, Vegas, etc. You think he's magically gonna have a perfect surrounding cast there? And besides, that's a discussion of ceiling, not floor. His floor is already known.
With 3 years and 40 games already in the books, by definition his floor cannot be higher than what we have already seen.
That is the crux of the matter and I totally get it that we don't agree on this. I look at his Ohio State play as his floor. I have seen him perform better with my own eyes when he has coaching and better players around him. I totally get it, that he won't have the talent he had at OSU. I accept that. But he can't have trash for a coach and the OL's we have put in front of him here either. And the WRs (other than DJ this year) have been pitiful.
Post by paytonisgod on Jan 20, 2024 13:46:55 GMT -6
Just want to add that Jamarcus Russel should really be taken out of that group and not counted. No one, other than old and crazy Al Davis thought he was worth a No. 1 pick. Many didn't even think he was a 1st round pick.
That draft is also a good example of why you need to get a high QB prospect when you can, as there is no guarantee the next draft is going to have the same quality at that position. The best QB to come out of that draft was Brady Quinn. What if we get a draft like that next year?
Just want to add that Jamarcus Russel should really be taken out of that group and not counted. No one, other than old and crazy Al Davis thought he was worth a No. 1 pick. Many didn't even think he was a 1st round pick.
That draft is also a good example of why you need to get a high QB prospect when you can, as there is no guarantee the next draft is going to have the same quality at that position. The best QB to come out of that draft was Brady Quinn. What if we get a draft like that next year?
That's a good point too. There is risk no matter what the Bears choose to do. Regarding Jamarcus Russel, when it comes to the QB1 position I think half the teams do lose their minds and do dumb things.
yeah, that's how I see it too. And that's why I want Fields to work out. Get him a good OC, good QB coach, a better OL and NHJ and then no excuses. Problem is, if I am wrong and he is not the guy, we blew past the 1st pick and then can't fix it any more. Mind grating decision
I'm having some serious angst over this too. But I am a bit leary about Williams' emotional makeup for the Bears gid (and admit that I may be completely wrong on him), and Maye has areas of his game that I wonder about... and again maybe I'm worrying over nothing. I'm thinking we may have a better QB in next year's draft... worst case next year we may be able to package our 2 first round picks to get the guy who is best for us at QB. And best case is that Fields does work out for us and we have 2 more 1st round draft picks NEXT year too. I think it may be the safest route with the least risk. Fields' floor may be higher than both Caleb & Maye's ceiling... but time will tell.
Fields floor higher than Williams ceiling? His floor is a below average NFL QB who only put up 2.5k passing yards. Jordan Love did over 4k. Dude come on... Let's be real about Fields.
Why keep waiting and waiting? We have the #1 overall pick. It will cost us no extra picks to get our QB. If we wait, it will cost us picks.
What franchise has multiple #1 overall picks and skips out on good QBs? We could be the Texans right now in the playoffs.
If I was poles, I'm picking Williams and trading up to #5 and getting Nabers. (Assuming 3 QB's go 1,2,3, and cardinals get MHJR)
Now you have Williams as QB, DJ Moore as #1, Nabers as #2, #4 round pick as a #3, and Kmet as your TE.
Doesn't that offense sound exciting?
Texans did a similar trade for a pass rusher going from #12 - #3.