This is why I hesitste to move from Fields. If I was convinced he was the problem, it would be different
I understand and sympathize with your viewpoint.
What would it take to convince you? Year 4 with his 3rd OC and Marvin Harrison? Will that do it?
I'm just wondering where the Fields-defenders intend to draw the line because o/w the goalposts keep getting moved. If he can't put up Stroud/Love type of numbers with a new OC and MHJ added, will that be enough?
I'm not sure I have a definitive answer for you. What I want to see is him behind a stout line and another good WR. So if we had a really good OL, an OC that could play to his strengths (and knew how to call better plays) and Harrison and he did not do any better, yeah. I'm off the Fields train. I just see a lot of ability there and am not convinced the issues are with him.
What would it take to convince you? Year 4 with his 3rd OC and Marvin Harrison? Will that do it?
I'm just wondering where the Fields-defenders intend to draw the line because o/w the goalposts keep getting moved. If he can't put up Stroud/Love type of numbers with a new OC and MHJ added, will that be enough?
I'm not sure I have a definitive answer for you. What I want to see is him behind a stout line and another good WR. So if we had a really good OL, an OC that could play to his strengths (and knew how to call better plays) and Harrison and he did not do any better, yeah. I'm off the Fields train. I just see a lot of ability there and am not convinced the issues are with him.
I'm a little concerned you can't come up with a definitive answer. Cuz otherwise its a never-ending loop of "better OL, another receiver, a different OC" yada, yada, yada with no endpoint in sight.
Its been 3 years and almost 40 games already.
And Btw, what are his strengths exactly? I think we all agree his running ability and elusiveness are excellent. I would hope well all also agree that those things aren't that important. Defenses are already adjusting and minimizing all that. Running QBs don't succeed or last long in the modern NFL. It's a passing league like it or not.
Here's his career passing stats: 6700 yards (2200/season), 60.2% compl rate, 40 TDs, 30 INTs, 82.3 rating
[WOOF]
Tell me, what are these "strengths" in the passing game you mentioned?
I'm not sure I have a definitive answer for you. What I want to see is him behind a stout line and another good WR. So if we had a really good OL, an OC that could play to his strengths (and knew how to call better plays) and Harrison and he did not do any better, yeah. I'm off the Fields train. I just see a lot of ability there and am not convinced the issues are with him.
I'm a little concerned you can't come up with a definitive answer. Cuz otherwise its a never-ending loop of "better OL, another receiver, a different OC" yada, yada, yada with no endpoint in sight.
Its been 3 years and almost 40 games already.
And Btw, what are his strengths exactly? I think we all agree his running ability and elusiveness are excellent. I would hope well all also agree that those things aren't that important. Defenses are already adjusting and minimizing all that. Running QBs don't succeed or last long in the modern NFL. It's a passing league like it or not.
Here's his career passing stats: 6700 yards (2200/season), 40 TDs, 30 INTs, 82.3 rating
[WOOF]
Tell me, what are these "strengths" in the passing game you mentioned?
The guy can place the ball on a dime. Yes, I have also seen him miss stuff that makes me shake my head. That is the consistency knock on him. Which is valid
I'm a little concerned you can't come up with a definitive answer. Cuz otherwise its a never-ending loop of "better OL, another receiver, a different OC" yada, yada, yada with no endpoint in sight.
Its been 3 years and almost 40 games already.
And Btw, what are his strengths exactly? I think we all agree his running ability and elusiveness are excellent. I would hope well all also agree that those things aren't that important. Defenses are already adjusting and minimizing all that. Running QBs don't succeed or last long in the modern NFL. It's a passing league like it or not.
Here's his career passing stats: 6700 yards (2200/season), 40 TDs, 30 INTs, 82.3 rating
[WOOF]
Tell me, what are these "strengths" in the passing game you mentioned?
The guy can place the ball on a dime. Yes, I have also seen him miss stuff that makes me shake my head. That is the consistency knock on him. Which is valid
He generally throws an excellent deep ball, no question there.
But if placing balls "on a dime" were truly a strength, he wouldn't have passing numbers in the bottom 3rd of the league. The stats above don't include yards lost in sacks nor fumbles, both of which aren't exactly strengths either.
The guy can place the ball on a dime. Yes, I have also seen him miss stuff that makes me shake my head. That is the consistency knock on him. Which is valid
He generally throws an excellent deep ball, no question there.
But if placing balls "on a dime" were truly a strength, he wouldn't have passing numbers in the bottom 3rd of the league. The stats above don't include yards lost in sacks nor fumbles, both of which aren't exactly strengths either.
It would if they didn't call passing plays all that well. Or if he didn't have a chance to air it out because he had no time. He can do it, but has not. So is it him or something else. I am thinking it is the something else
He generally throws an excellent deep ball, no question there.
But if placing balls "on a dime" were truly a strength, he wouldn't have passing numbers in the bottom 3rd of the league. The stats above don't include yards lost in sacks nor fumbles, both of which aren't exactly strengths either.
It would if they didn't call passing plays all that well. Or if he didn't have a chance to air it out because he had no time. He can do it, but has not. So is it him or something else. I am thinking it is the something else
For me, it goes back to his OSU days. Watch the film - he is extremely accurate on all passes (short, mid, and deep balls), he is elusive, effective, etc. The MAIN difference between his OSU days and his NFL days is that at OSU he had ALL DAMN DAY to throw the ball. His OLine there was elite, and they offered great protection even against top D-Lines. Fields obviously needs more time in the pocket in the NFL, as we witnessed against Green Bay. However, this is the NFL so he's never going to have the time luxury in the pocket that he had at OSU. To me, that is the million-dollar question: If we upgrade the OLIne and get Fields more time in the pocket, is he able to make the changes to release the ball earlier to meet the time in the middle? If so, he could be a very effective and successfull NFL QB. If not, then we've seen his ceiling.
It would if they didn't call passing plays all that well. Or if he didn't have a chance to air it out because he had no time. He can do it, but has not. So is it him or something else. I am thinking it is the something else
For me, it goes back to his OSU days. Watch the film - he is extremely accurate on all passes (short, mid, and deep balls), he is elusive, effective, etc. The MAIN difference between his OSU days and his NFL days is that at OSU he had ALL DAMN DAY to throw the ball. His OLine there was elite, and they offered great protection even against top D-Lines. Fields obviously needs more time in the pocket in the NFL, as we witnessed against Green Bay. However, this is the NFL so he's never going to have the time luxury in the pocket that he had at OSU. To me, that is the million-dollar question: If we upgrade the OLIne and get Fields more time in the pocket, is he able to make the changes to release the ball earlier to meet the time in the middle? If so, he could be a very effective and successfull NFL QB. If not, then we've seen his ceiling.
In a nutshell, that is it. Does the extra time get him more confidence to continue to progress? It should help him relax and slow the game down. HOPEFULLY, in turn that will make him calm down and see the field better and faster and give him the confidence to place the ball where the receiver is not yet at. And help with consistency. That will again hopefully carry him to when he doesn't have time. Even with a great line, there are times you just don't have much time. I am betting he can get there with a better line, better targets and better advice/coaching and schemes. We are likely to get a more gifted athlete. But most of what a QB does is mental. I do see him doing better at progressions, and he makes better decisions in terms of getting rid of the ball. Still has a long way to go, but I see progress. Give him what he needs and then we will know for sure. But like more than one person has said.... By then we will have used up our first pick. So if we bet on Fields and pass on a QB and he does not come through, we have screwed ourselves. Of course the QB we pick could also not work out and we could screw ourselves by picking a new QB. Again, not a decision I would want to make. So many more ways for things to go wrong than to go right.
This is why I hesitste to move from Fields. If I was convinced he was the problem, it would be different
I understand and sympathize with your viewpoint.
What would it take to convince you? Year 4 with his 3rd OC and Marvin Harrison? Will that do it?
I'm just wondering where the Fields-defenders intend to draw the line because o/w the goalposts keep getting moved. If he can't put up Stroud/Love type of numbers with a new OC and MHJ added, will that be enough?
I’ll answer the question. My standard for Fields is the same as my standard for Poles: Super Bowl ready by 2025. It is not enough just to make the playoffs and look like the Dallas Cowboys every year.
For me, it goes back to his OSU days. Watch the film - he is extremely accurate on all passes (short, mid, and deep balls), he is elusive, effective, etc. The MAIN difference between his OSU days and his NFL days is that at OSU he had ALL DAMN DAY to throw the ball. His OLine there was elite, and they offered great protection even against top D-Lines. Fields obviously needs more time in the pocket in the NFL, as we witnessed against Green Bay. However, this is the NFL so he's never going to have the time luxury in the pocket that he had at OSU. To me, that is the million-dollar question: If we upgrade the OLIne and get Fields more time in the pocket, is he able to make the changes to release the ball earlier to meet the time in the middle? If so, he could be a very effective and successfull NFL QB. If not, then we've seen his ceiling.
In a nutshell, that is it. Does the extra time get him more confidence to continue to progress? It should help him relax and slow the game down. HOPEFULLY, in turn that will make him calm down and see the field better and faster and give him the confidence to place the ball where the receiver is not yet at. And help with consistency. That will again hopefully carry him to when he doesn't have time. Even with a great line, there are times you just don't have much time. I am betting he can get there with a better line, better targets and better advice/coaching and schemes. We are likely to get a more gifted athlete. But most of what a QB does is mental. I do see him doing better at progressions, and he makes better decisions in terms of getting rid of the ball. Still has a long way to go, but I see progress. Give him what he needs and then we will know for sure. But like more than one person has said.... By then we will have used up our first pick. So if we bet on Fields and pass on a QB and he does not come through, we have screwed ourselves. Of course the QB we pick could also not work out and we could screw ourselves by picking a new QB. Again, not a decision I would want to make. So many more ways for things to go wrong than to go right.
The question to ask yourself is how much faith do you have in fields to lead you to the promise land? What has Fields shown to you in his 3 years of him running the offense that he is the guy?
He's one of the worst 4th Quarter QBs in the NFL. He hasn't even thrown for 3k passing yards He can never anticipate where his WR are going to go.
Even Trubisky had two 3k+ yard seasons.
Before the Packers game I thought maybe he did improve from week 1. That game truly showed us that we can not run it back with him. Its not his fault we lost but at the same time he did nothing to help us. Zero TDs. Sub 150 yard game. Packers have one of the worse defenses in the league. If Fields would of had a game where he did 200-250 passing yards with 2 TDs. I would run it back.
#1 Williams QB #9 Odunze WR
This needs to be our first two picks. (Unless Nabers lands at #9)
In a nutshell, that is it. Does the extra time get him more confidence to continue to progress? It should help him relax and slow the game down. HOPEFULLY, in turn that will make him calm down and see the field better and faster and give him the confidence to place the ball where the receiver is not yet at. And help with consistency. That will again hopefully carry him to when he doesn't have time. Even with a great line, there are times you just don't have much time. I am betting he can get there with a better line, better targets and better advice/coaching and schemes. We are likely to get a more gifted athlete. But most of what a QB does is mental. I do see him doing better at progressions, and he makes better decisions in terms of getting rid of the ball. Still has a long way to go, but I see progress. Give him what he needs and then we will know for sure. But like more than one person has said.... By then we will have used up our first pick. So if we bet on Fields and pass on a QB and he does not come through, we have screwed ourselves. Of course the QB we pick could also not work out and we could screw ourselves by picking a new QB. Again, not a decision I would want to make. So many more ways for things to go wrong than to go right.
The question to ask yourself is how much faith do you have in fields to lead you to the promise land? What has Fields shown to you in his 3 years of him running the offense that he is the guy?
He's one of the worst 4th Quarter QBs in the NFL. He hasn't even thrown for 3k passing yards He can never anticipate where his WR are going to go.
Even Trubisky had two 3k+ yard seasons.
Before the Packers game I thought maybe he did improve from week 1. That game truly showed us that we can not run it back with him. Its not his fault we lost but at the same time he did nothing to help us. Zero TDs. Sub 150 yard game. Packers have one of the worse defenses in the league. If Fields would of had a game where he did 200-250 passing yards with 2 TDs. I would run it back.
#1 Williams QB #9 Odunze WR
This needs to be our first two picks. (Unless Nabers lands at #9)
You do realize that there were only 16 passes in the Packers game, and many of them were with pass rush closing in from all directions?
The standard Getsy plan: First down: run Second down: run Third down: throw a screen pass Fourth down: punt