Flus being non commital tells me IR is right around the corner.
Fields is gonna miss at least a few games, IR or no IR. Bank on it. Those type of injuries HURT BAD I know personally and there's no way to grip properly with a hurt thumb like that.
Which means he might only have 5-7 games left when he gets healthy. Which means he has very few opportunities left to change the emerging narrative about him.
Which means Poles will be moving on if he has the high pick(s) to do so.
Flus being non commital tells me IR is right around the corner.
Fields is gonna miss at least a few games, IR or no IR. Bank on it. Those type of injuries HURT BAD I know personally and there's no way to grip properly with a hurt thumb like that.
Which means he might only have 5-7 games left when he gets healthy. Which means he has very few opportunities left to change the emerging narrative about him.
Which means Poles will be moving on if he has the high pick(s) to do so.
Not hard to read the writing on the wall here...
Nope, but TBH I would think "if" the worst case scenario I read with surgery manifested itself Fields is done as a Bear.
He's under contract for 2024 with a "void year" in 2025. In effect, he has one year left with the Bears after this season. Moving on from him before 2024 season would recoup $12.5M in cap with a $5.5M dead cap hit so a net savings of $7M.
If we are reloading at QB (which certainly looks like the way this is heading), it makes sense to trade away or even release assets you have that won't be part of that process. I like Eddie Jackson but reality check time here -- he's north of 30, past his prime, and has bitten by the injury bug a lot lately. He went out again yesterday with another foot injury. Do you really think he's worth keeping around for the 2-3 years its gonna take to retool the QB position?
Those are all good points. What depressed me (and I'm sure you too) is that the team will be set back with a coaching and QB reset. I understand the need for it, but that doesn't mean it's a pleasant thought. It's kind of like getting surgery done that is necessary but still painful to endure the rehab and recovery that follows. A reset is necessary but I so dread the setback because I thought that this time we had finally turned a corner here with the new GM/HC and Fields. Worse, is the thought that there is zero guarantee that a reset will be successful.
In my head I think of what the offense needs to truly support yet another young QB coming in - and I'm not wanting to see the Bears lose focus by spending resources on defense. Oh, I get the need. A team has to have a baseline of talent on defense too. But the top-level draft and cap resources are limited (the top level) and I so want to see them spent on (finally) building a solid offense - complete with a QB who can run the offense.
I know the offense has had investment in the past but the offense is still pitiful. Going forward we need investment - and investment in the resources that fix the problem. Not half-fix it. LOL, today I've been dealing with our plumber in our home (long story)... but the comparison would be investing a ton of money "fixing" the plumbing but the plumbing still has pipes leaking everywhere. I may have spent a fortune on the plumbing bill. But if the problems are not fixed, well, that isn't getting me anywhere. Same with the Bears not getting a good return on their O investment.
He's under contract for 2024 with a "void year" in 2025. In effect, he has one year left with the Bears after this season. Moving on from him before 2024 season would recoup $12.5M in cap with a $5.5M dead cap hit so a net savings of $7M.
If we are reloading at QB (which certainly looks like the way this is heading), it makes sense to trade away or even release assets you have that won't be part of that process. I like Eddie Jackson but reality check time here -- he's north of 30, past his prime, and has bitten by the injury bug a lot lately. He went out again yesterday with another foot injury. Do you really think he's worth keeping around for the 2-3 years its gonna take to retool the QB position?
Those are all good points. What depressed me (and I'm sure you too) is that the team will be set back with a coaching and QB reset. I understand the need for it, but that doesn't mean it's a pleasant thought. It's kind of like getting surgery done that is necessary but still painful to endure the rehab and recovery that follows. A reset is necessary but I so dread the setback because I thought that this time we had finally turned a corner here with the new GM/HC and Fields. Worse, is the thought that there is zero guarantee that a reset will be successful.
In my head I think of what the offense needs to truly support yet another young QB coming in - and I'm not wanting to see the Bears lose focus by spending resources on defense. Oh, I get the need. A team has to have a baseline of talent on defense too. But the top-level draft and cap resources are limited (the top level) and I so want to see them spent on (finally) building a solid offense - complete with a QB who can run the offense.
I know the offense has had investment in the past but the offense is still pitiful. Going forward we need investment - and investment in the resources that fix the problem. Not half-fix it. LOL, today I've been dealing with our plumber in our home (long story)... but the comparison would be investing a ton of money "fixing" the plumbing but the plumbing still has pipes leaking everywhere. I may have spent a fortune on the plumbing bill. But if the problems are not fixed, well, that isn't getting me anywhere. Same with the Bears not getting a good return on their O investment.
Yes, when a 1st round draft pick QB, especially one you paid extra to trade up for, BUSTS, its a major organizational setback. It almost always sweeps out the coaching regime too. How many teams just happen to have a spare good QB lying around? None, except for SF with Brock Purdy. A one-in-a-million stroke of good luck.
There's zero guarantee a QB reset will be successful. ZERO. In fact, most 1st round QBs eventually fail. I could write you a long list of those just from the past 10-15 years. [Wentz, Winston, Lance, Locker, Gabbert, Mac Jones, Trubisky, Mariota, Zach Wilson...shall I go on?]
For the sake of discussion, I'll ask you this: Was the offense "pitiful" in weeks 4 & 5? Was the offense pitiful the other 4 games? Why was your answer different between those two questions? What changed?
We can all cite several factors but most importantly what REALLYCHANGED? This isn't rocket science my friend. No need to overthink it here. It's not a trick question.
The QB plays well -----> the offense looks damn good
The QB plays like ass -----> the offense looks pitiful
It's pretty freakin' simple. That's 90% of the observable change right there. Trying to win in the modern NFL with a struggling QB is like trying to keep your head above water with a weight tied to your feet.
Like I have said multiple times, I'm not gonna waste my time arguing about how much of that falls on the OC and how much falls on the QB himself. Undoubtedly there's blame on both sides. They both need to be changed out. They both need to go. It's simply not working.
Post by bearsfaninaz on Oct 16, 2023 18:13:14 GMT -6
I think the honest reality of this is we all wanted Fields to be the guy. This will all but likely be his 3rd HC in 4 years, and he's still having the same issues he had as a rookie. I would think a new HC would want to get "his QB" and build that relationship together. Me personally would want Maye in the 1st or Nix in the 2nd/3rd right now. I'm sure there's other QBs out there that I haven't seen play at all, but of the big 3 Williams, Maye, Nix the one I want the least involvement with is Williams. He reminds me of Fields right now. We will see though.
I think the honest reality of this is we all wanted Fields to be the guy. This will all but likely be his 3rd HC in 4 years, and he's still having the same issues he had as a rookie. I would think a new HC would want to get "his QB" and build that relationship together. Me personally would want Maye in the 1st or Nix in the 2nd/3rd right now. I'm sure there's other QBs out there that I haven't seen play at all, but of the big 3 Williams, Maye, Nix the one I want the least involvement with is Williams. He reminds me of Fields right now. We will see though.
Yep
That's what is so deflating and why this message board has gone radio silent. We are all shellshocked at seeing what has transpired this season.
I never would have guessed 2 months ago that Fields would fall flat this bad and the offense would still look this bad.
The defense held the Vikings to only 220 yards of offense on Sunday and the O still couldn't win the game. Biggs published this: the Bears are 1-4 in the last 5 games they held the opposing offense to 220 yards or less.
That's truly hard to do. Its actually difficult to have an NFL offense this bad.
Remember that anyone you trade now needs to be replaced as a starter/ If you trade Jackson you are drafting a S early, maybe the first if they trade down. If you trade Johnson you are drafting a CB early (2nd round most likely). I know we all want to draft OFF from now until 2028, but if you trade these guys you have to replace them either in the draft or with subpar talent in FA that you overpay for.
We need to be careful what we wish for.
Wait… Bears already have Johnson's replacement → Stevenson. Gordon is in the slot and Terell Smith is poised for a bigger role in 2024.
As far as Jackson, Hicks has already begun to fill his role. Not well, but he's at least as good as BoJack has been post new contract.
There's litte to suggest Poles/a new GM would *need* to take either position high.
I think the honest reality of this is we all wanted Fields to be the guy. This will all but likely be his 3rd HC in 4 years, and he's still having the same issues he had as a rookie. I would think a new HC would want to get "his QB" and build that relationship together. Me personally would want Maye in the 1st or Nix in the 2nd/3rd right now. I'm sure there's other QBs out there that I haven't seen play at all, but of the big 3 Williams, Maye, Nix the one I want the least involvement with is Williams. He reminds me of Fields right now. We will see though.
Yep
That's what is so deflating and why this message board has gone radio silent. We are all shellshocked at seeing what has transpired this season.
I never would have guessed 2 months ago that Fields would fall flat this bad and the offense would still look this bad.
The defense held the Vikings to only 220 yards of offense on Sunday and the O still couldn't win the game. Biggs published this: the Bears are 1-4 in the last 5 games they held the opposing offense to 220 yards or less.
That's truly hard to do. Its actually difficult to have an NFL offense this bad.
It's literally the worst in the NFL in a variety of categories. I don't think I've ever seen a franchise this storied shine so brightly for it's level of ineptitude.
Remember that anyone you trade now needs to be replaced as a starter/ If you trade Jackson you are drafting a S early, maybe the first if they trade down. If you trade Johnson you are drafting a CB early (2nd round most likely). I know we all want to draft OFF from now until 2028, but if you trade these guys you have to replace them either in the draft or with subpar talent in FA that you overpay for.
We need to be careful what we wish for.
Wait… Bears already have Johnson's replacement → Stevenson. Gordon is in the slot and Terell Smith is poised for a bigger role in 2024.
As far as Jackson, Hicks has already begun to fill his role. Not well, but he's at least as good as BoJack has been post new contract.
There's litte to suggest Poles/a new GM would *need* to take either position high.
If that is the case then sure trade them. But you will still need a S and CB to fill those roster slots. I'm not arguing for keeping them, all I'm saying is that we did the tear down, Johnson is young and worth keeping. Why create two holes? And if our argument for keeping Hicks is that he's playing but (by your admissions) "not well" at playing safety I'd rather keep BoJack as a vet in that young secondary.
Trade um, don't trade um it won't matter by the time a new QB is up and running. But if Jackson and Johnson are let go I'm willing to wager that the Bears draft a CB and a S by by the time the third round is over.
Wait… Bears already have Johnson's replacement → Stevenson. Gordon is in the slot and Terell Smith is poised for a bigger role in 2024.
As far as Jackson, Hicks has already begun to fill his role. Not well, but he's at least as good as BoJack has been post new contract.
There's litte to suggest Poles/a new GM would *need* to take either position high.
If that is the case then sure trade them. But you will still need a S and CB to fill those roster slots. I'm not arguing for keeping them, all I'm saying is that we did the tear down, Johnson is young and worth keeping. Why create two holes? And if our argument for keeping Hicks is that he's playing but (by your admissions) "not well" at playing safety I'd rather keep BoJack as a vet in that young secondary.
Trade um, don't trade um it won't matter by the time a new QB is up and running. But if Jackson and Johnson are let go I'm willing to wager that the Bears draft a CB and a S by by the time the third round is over.
Eh, I still disagree. There is always free agency, the market looks saturated with upgrades from Hicks that won't cost a lot.
And, again, Bears already loaded up on CB in preparation to let go of JJ. This is where you can spend another later pick - like Terell Smith, veteran depth player via FA, or rock with Greg Stroman, Jaylon Jones, or Josh Blackwell.
Nothing suggest we have to spend high draft capital to replace with JJ or BoJack. I mean, if BPA falls that was, it's a different story.