This may be a parallel situation to Long. A probowl player at G that will only be ok at another position. Has anyone seen him play C?
I found this tweet by Bran Biggs to be interesting:
Brad Biggs @bradbiggs 2m2 minutes ago
Obviously, would need a 3rd move if they were to sign former #Packers G Josh Sitton. If Sitton came on board, my guess is Whitehair to C.
I don't see Whitehair as a good option at center. I'd much rather Whitehair sat the bench with Larsen taking center reps and Sitton taking reps at LG. Remember, Long has a labral tear and might need to take some time off during the reg season. In that event, Sitton is the perfect signing. He can fill in at LG and provide stability in the event ANY of the interior OL players take time off due to injury.
His movement skills and ability to block in space were limited which would affect how The Log could run his offense.
The Log may be downgraded to the Stump if he does not land Sitton. Sorry, but Slauson wasa damned good C and I think he would have gotten better. The dude did it out of the clear blue and was good. I think maybe letting him get more reps with blocking in space might have been a better path, but no one asked me (yeah, I'm still kind of surprised too)
It wasnt clear blue, he played some C with the Jets too
This may be a parallel situation to Long. A probowl player at G that will only be ok at another position. Has anyone seen him play C?
I found this tweet by Bran Biggs to be interesting:
Brad Biggs @bradbiggs 2m2 minutes ago
Obviously, would need a 3rd move if they were to sign former #Packers G Josh Sitton. If Sitton came on board, my guess is Whitehair to C.
Remember, Long has a labral tear and might need to take some time off during the reg season. In that event, Sitton is the perfect signing. He can fill in at LG
Actually, that had never crossed my mind. You make an excellent point. Not too many people that I would trust to replace Long, but Sitton would be a guy. If need be , get Long under the knife, rod him up and let him heal to hopefully play later in the season. Just on path, but having a real option to replace Long short term is a great idea.
The Slauson release was outright boneheaded move. I don't expect him to get Sitton because it would validate his bone headed move. But, I'm hoping he puts his ego aside and does the right thing for the team by making it better. Like they always espouse "if there's a better guy out there that can make the team better we'll get him." Well here's your opportunity, but I always think that is more of a lip service quote like saying "we have to play hard all 60 minutes."
The Chicago Bears are the first team veteran guard Josh Sitton will visit with per Adam Schefter:
Adam Schefter @adamschefter 18m18 minutes ago Looks like former Packers' Pro Bowl G Josh Sitton's first visit will be to...division-rival Chicago Bears, per sources. Saints could follow
Regarding the 'boneheadedness' of Pace's release of Slauson, most on the board feel strongly it was the wrong move. It was Pace's move to make though. Pace with input from the coaching staff did not feel that Slauson was a good fit for their shift into a zone blocking scheme. His movement skills and ability to block in space were limited which would affect how The Log could run his offense. At the time of his release, Pace had veteran Manny Ramirez and Hroniss Grasu on the roster. I think in hindsight the move seems boneheaded at the time the move was frustrating BUT it was clear a plan was in place.
With that said, I don't think Pace will have any issues bringing in and signing Sitton if he can ink him to a good deal. One of the issues will be the recent signing of Kyle Long for 10 million a year. Pace basically set a negotiation point for Sitton and his agent as both Long and Sitton are 3x Pro-Bowl guards. Might be hard to ink him to a deal though the fact they are bringing him in AND the fact he came here first bodes well for the team.
Two separate issues here and both worth commenting on.
First of all I think belli is 100% on target here and I'm not sure why this keeps coming up as if no one has ever read all of the 100 pages plus of articles and other analysis of why it happened.
As good as Slauson was a pass blocking OG and also versatile enough to play OC he was not a good fit for a zone blocking scheme at either position. It's clear the plan was to have Grasu start at OC with Ramirez as his backup and a spare OG. Moving Slauson from being a starting RG (where they drafted Whitehair to start) to becoming a backup OC and using $3.5 mil of cap space up on a backup OL wasn't gonna happen. Ramirez was both more experienced at OC and much cheaper but no one could have predicted he'd just up and retire any more than they could have predicted Grasu's knee injury. That was the real killer.
So there was a plan to replace Slauson in effect but it failed for both of those reasons.
Sitton was due to make $5.9 mil in 2016 which may have been part of the reason the Porkers had for releasing him. If he's 100% healthy then I'm gonna take a wild guess here and say that although they may have approached him about restructuring his deal he may also have refused to do that preferring instead to become a FA and market himself now when there aren't any OL of his talents available. Smart move on his part I'd say.
I think we can accept that he's not gonna be willing to take a one year vet minimum deal of the type that Pace loves to do with players like this but how much more than that will it take? I read just one rumor so far that he's asking for something around what he was due to make in the $5.5 mil per year range but he also wants a four year deal and some reasonable $$$ guaranteed. IMHO that's what Pace and Sitton's agent will battle over as the talk.
At $22 mil or thereabouts he's half the price of what we just gave Long and while he may be worth that and I wouldn't hesitate to consider a 4 year deal the amount of $$$ guaranteed may be the sticking point. But, we're still in a better spot cap wise than NOLA if that's his next scheduled stop. So can NOLA afford him or are they just sticking if back to Pace for going after one of their FAs? It could be either I guess.
I'd be very happy to see him not leave Chicago without a deal but I'm thinking what Pace has in mind might be a 3 year deal for a little more than he gave Massie with maybe two years or the equivalent guaranteed. Something like $15mil/3yrs/$10 mil in bonus and salary guarantees. But I'm still curious about whether there's an injury issue with him that hasn't been revealed. Sitton is one of the best pass blocking OGs in the NFL and the Porkers are a passing team. It's still a bit odd they would let him go free knowing that.
The Chicago Bears are the first team veteran guard Josh Sitton will visit with per Adam Schefter:
Adam Schefter @adamschefter 18m18 minutes ago Looks like former Packers' Pro Bowl G Josh Sitton's first visit will be to...division-rival Chicago Bears, per sources. Saints could follow
Regarding the 'boneheadedness' of Pace's release of Slauson, most on the board feel strongly it was the wrong move. It was Pace's move to make though. Pace with input from the coaching staff did not feel that Slauson was a good fit for their shift into a zone blocking scheme. His movement skills and ability to block in space were limited which would affect how The Log could run his offense. At the time of his release, Pace had veteran Manny Ramirez and Hroniss Grasu on the roster. I think in hindsight the move seems boneheaded at the time the move was frustrating BUT it was clear a plan was in place.
With that said, I don't think Pace will have any issues bringing in and signing Sitton if he can ink him to a good deal. One of the issues will be the recent signing of Kyle Long for 10 million a year. Pace basically set a negotiation point for Sitton and his agent as both Long and Sitton are 3x Pro-Bowl guards. Might be hard to ink him to a deal though the fact they are bringing him in AND the fact he came here first bodes well for the team.
Two separate issues here and both worth commenting on.
First of all I think belli is 100% on target here and I'm not sure why this keeps coming up as if no one has ever read all of the 100 pages plus of articles and other analysis of why it happened.
As good as Slauson was a pass blocking OG and also versatile enough to play OC he was not a good fit for a zone blocking scheme at either position. It's clear the plan was to have Grasu start at OC with Ramirez as his backup and a spare OG. Moving Slauson from being a starting RG (where they drafted Whitehair to start) to becoming a backup OC and using $3.5 mil of cap space up on a backup OL wasn't gonna happen. Ramirez was both more experienced at OC and much cheaper but no one could have predicted he'd just up and retire any more than they could have predicted Grasu's knee injury. That was the real killer.
So there was a plan to replace Slauson in effect but it failed for both of those reasons.
Sitton was due to make $5.9 mil in 2016 which may have been part of the reason the Porkers had for releasing him. If he's 100% healthy then I'm gonna take a wild guess here and say that although they may have approached him about restructuring his deal he may also have refused to do that preferring instead to become a FA and market himself now when there aren't any OL of his talents available. Smart move on his part I'd say.
I think we can accept that he's not gonna be willing to take a one year vet minimum deal of the type that Pace loves to do with players like this but how much more than that will it take? I read just one rumor so far that he's asking for something around what he was due to make in the $5.5 mil per year range but he also wants a four year deal and some reasonable $$$ guaranteed. IMHO that's what Pace and Sitton's agent will battle over as the talk.
At $22 mil or thereabouts he's half the price of what we just gave Long and while he may be worth that and I wouldn't hesitate to consider a 4 year deal the amount of $$$ guaranteed may be the sticking point. But, we're still in a better spot cap wise than NOLA if that's his next scheduled stop. So can NOLA afford him or are they just sticking if back to Pace for going after one of their FAs? It could be either I guess.
I'd be very happy to see him not leave Chicago without a deal but I'm thinking what Pace has in mind might be a 3 year deal for a little more than he gave Massie with maybe two years or the equivalent guaranteed. Something like $15mil/3yrs/$10 mil in bonus and salary guarantees. But I'm still curious about whether there's an injury issue with him that hasn't been revealed. Sitton is one of the best pass blocking OGs in the NFL and the Porkers are a passing team. It's still a bit odd they would let him go free knowing that.
That could kill the deal IMO. 4 year deal with guarantees on a 30 year old lineman with back problems? Yes, he is a probowler (well, was), but I guess it all depends on the guarantees he wants. We'll see. Glad that it seems like he might want to be a Bear. He already looks like one.
The Chicago Bears are the first team veteran guard Josh Sitton will visit with per Adam Schefter:
Adam Schefter @adamschefter 18m18 minutes ago Looks like former Packers' Pro Bowl G Josh Sitton's first visit will be to...division-rival Chicago Bears, per sources. Saints could follow
Regarding the 'boneheadedness' of Pace's release of Slauson, most on the board feel strongly it was the wrong move. It was Pace's move to make though. Pace with input from the coaching staff did not feel that Slauson was a good fit for their shift into a zone blocking scheme. His movement skills and ability to block in space were limited which would affect how The Log could run his offense. At the time of his release, Pace had veteran Manny Ramirez and Hroniss Grasu on the roster. I think in hindsight the move seems boneheaded at the time the move was frustrating BUT it was clear a plan was in place.
With that said, I don't think Pace will have any issues bringing in and signing Sitton if he can ink him to a good deal. One of the issues will be the recent signing of Kyle Long for 10 million a year. Pace basically set a negotiation point for Sitton and his agent as both Long and Sitton are 3x Pro-Bowl guards. Might be hard to ink him to a deal though the fact they are bringing him in AND the fact he came here first bodes well for the team.
Two separate issues here and both worth commenting on.
First of all I think belli is 100% on target here and I'm not sure why this keeps coming up as if no one has ever read all of the 100 pages plus of articles and other analysis of why it happened.
As good as Slauson was a pass blocking OG and also versatile enough to play OC he was not a good fit for a zone blocking scheme at either position. It's clear the plan was to have Grasu start at OC with Ramirez as his backup and a spare OG. Moving Slauson from being a starting RG (where they drafted Whitehair to start) to becoming a backup OC and using $3.5 mil of cap space up on a backup OL wasn't gonna happen. Ramirez was both more experienced at OC and much cheaper but no one could have predicted he'd just up and retire any more than they could have predicted Grasu's knee injury. That was the real killer.
So there was a plan to replace Slauson in effect but it failed for both of those reasons.
Sitton was due to make $5.9 mil in 2016 which may have been part of the reason the Porkers had for releasing him. If he's 100% healthy then I'm gonna take a wild guess here and say that although they may have approached him about restructuring his deal he may also have refused to do that preferring instead to become a FA and market himself now when there aren't any OL of his talents available. Smart move on his part I'd say.
I think we can accept that he's not gonna be willing to take a one year vet minimum deal of the type that Pace loves to do with players like this but how much more than that will it take? I read just one rumor so far that he's asking for something around what he was due to make in the $5.5 mil per year range but he also wants a four year deal and some reasonable $$$ guaranteed. IMHO that's what Pace and Sitton's agent will battle over as the talk.
At $22 mil or thereabouts he's half the price of what we just gave Long and while he may be worth that and I wouldn't hesitate to consider a 4 year deal the amount of $$$ guaranteed may be the sticking point. But, we're still in a better spot cap wise than NOLA if that's his next scheduled stop. So can NOLA afford him or are they just sticking if back to Pace for going after one of their FAs? It could be either I guess.
I'd be very happy to see him not leave Chicago without a deal but I'm thinking what Pace has in mind might be a 3 year deal for a little more than he gave Massie with maybe two years or the equivalent guaranteed. Something like $15mil/3yrs/$10 mil in bonus and salary guarantees. But I'm still curious about whether there's an injury issue with him that hasn't been revealed. Sitton is one of the best pass blocking OGs in the NFL and the Porkers are a passing team. It's still a bit odd they would let him go free knowing that.
This is why I didn't want to get my hopes up too high. Sitton is not the typical FA you find floating around the league late in the offseason. He is going to want a healthy amount of coin, a multi-year deal, and guarantees. Wherever he signs is likely to be his last real starter's-type contract. Like Soul said, I think a reasonable compromise is a 3-4 yr deal with most/all the guaranteed money in the first 2. I hope Pace can get this done.
Two separate issues here and both worth commenting on.
First of all I think belli is 100% on target here and I'm not sure why this keeps coming up as if no one has ever read all of the 100 pages plus of articles and other analysis of why it happened.
As good as Slauson was a pass blocking OG and also versatile enough to play OC he was not a good fit for a zone blocking scheme at either position. It's clear the plan was to have Grasu start at OC with Ramirez as his backup and a spare OG. Moving Slauson from being a starting RG (where they drafted Whitehair to start) to becoming a backup OC and using $3.5 mil of cap space up on a backup OL wasn't gonna happen. Ramirez was both more experienced at OC and much cheaper but no one could have predicted he'd just up and retire any more than they could have predicted Grasu's knee injury. That was the real killer.
So there was a plan to replace Slauson in effect but it failed for both of those reasons.
Sitton was due to make $5.9 mil in 2016 which may have been part of the reason the Porkers had for releasing him. If he's 100% healthy then I'm gonna take a wild guess here and say that although they may have approached him about restructuring his deal he may also have refused to do that preferring instead to become a FA and market himself now when there aren't any OL of his talents available. Smart move on his part I'd say.
I think we can accept that he's not gonna be willing to take a one year vet minimum deal of the type that Pace loves to do with players like this but how much more than that will it take? I read just one rumor so far that he's asking for something around what he was due to make in the $5.5 mil per year range but he also wants a four year deal and some reasonable $$$ guaranteed. IMHO that's what Pace and Sitton's agent will battle over as the talk.
At $22 mil or thereabouts he's half the price of what we just gave Long and while he may be worth that and I wouldn't hesitate to consider a 4 year deal the amount of $$$ guaranteed may be the sticking point. But, we're still in a better spot cap wise than NOLA if that's his next scheduled stop. So can NOLA afford him or are they just sticking if back to Pace for going after one of their FAs? It could be either I guess.
I'd be very happy to see him not leave Chicago without a deal but I'm thinking what Pace has in mind might be a 3 year deal for a little more than he gave Massie with maybe two years or the equivalent guaranteed. Something like $15mil/3yrs/$10 mil in bonus and salary guarantees. But I'm still curious about whether there's an injury issue with him that hasn't been revealed. Sitton is one of the best pass blocking OGs in the NFL and the Porkers are a passing team. It's still a bit odd they would let him go free knowing that.
That could kill the deal IMO. 4 year deal with guarantees on a 30 year old lineman with back problems? Yes, he is a probowler (well, was), but I guess it all depends on the guarantees he wants. We'll see. Glad that it seems like he might want to be a Bear. He already looks like one.
The length of the deal means very little if anything with these 30 year old guys. As long as we aren't guaranteeing more than we're willing to risk for as long as we're willing to risk it we should be fine. Unless he remains at or near his previous levels he won't ever see all of the money anyway.
I'd be happy to see a solid year or two out of him starting at OC for now if he can handle that. If he can still play RG at a high level that also means they have some options next year as far as how to use Long. Fox and Magazu tend to like versatility in their interior OL so we'll see what happens.
I'd be shocked but very pleasantly surprised if Pace can get him to commit to a very team friendly two year deal though.
Two separate issues here and both worth commenting on.
First of all I think belli is 100% on target here and I'm not sure why this keeps coming up as if no one has ever read all of the 100 pages plus of articles and other analysis of why it happened.
As good as Slauson was a pass blocking OG and also versatile enough to play OC he was not a good fit for a zone blocking scheme at either position. It's clear the plan was to have Grasu start at OC with Ramirez as his backup and a spare OG. Moving Slauson from being a starting RG (where they drafted Whitehair to start) to becoming a backup OC and using $3.5 mil of cap space up on a backup OL wasn't gonna happen. Ramirez was both more experienced at OC and much cheaper but no one could have predicted he'd just up and retire any more than they could have predicted Grasu's knee injury. That was the real killer.
So there was a plan to replace Slauson in effect but it failed for both of those reasons.
Sitton was due to make $5.9 mil in 2016 which may have been part of the reason the Porkers had for releasing him. If he's 100% healthy then I'm gonna take a wild guess here and say that although they may have approached him about restructuring his deal he may also have refused to do that preferring instead to become a FA and market himself now when there aren't any OL of his talents available. Smart move on his part I'd say.
I think we can accept that he's not gonna be willing to take a one year vet minimum deal of the type that Pace loves to do with players like this but how much more than that will it take? I read just one rumor so far that he's asking for something around what he was due to make in the $5.5 mil per year range but he also wants a four year deal and some reasonable $$$ guaranteed. IMHO that's what Pace and Sitton's agent will battle over as the talk.
At $22 mil or thereabouts he's half the price of what we just gave Long and while he may be worth that and I wouldn't hesitate to consider a 4 year deal the amount of $$$ guaranteed may be the sticking point. But, we're still in a better spot cap wise than NOLA if that's his next scheduled stop. So can NOLA afford him or are they just sticking if back to Pace for going after one of their FAs? It could be either I guess.
I'd be very happy to see him not leave Chicago without a deal but I'm thinking what Pace has in mind might be a 3 year deal for a little more than he gave Massie with maybe two years or the equivalent guaranteed. Something like $15mil/3yrs/$10 mil in bonus and salary guarantees. But I'm still curious about whether there's an injury issue with him that hasn't been revealed. Sitton is one of the best pass blocking OGs in the NFL and the Porkers are a passing team. It's still a bit odd they would let him go free knowing that.
This is why I didn't want to get my hopes up too high. Sitton is not the typical FA you find floating around the league late in the offseason. He is going to want a healthy amount of coin, a multi-year deal, and guarantees. Wherever he signs is likely to be his last real starter's-type contract. Like Soul said, I think a reasonable compromise is a 3-4 yr deal with most/all the guaranteed money in the first 2. I hope Pace can get this done.
I'd like to think that will be Pace's starting point. I'm not aware of any reported back injury but I do know he played through a foot injury a couple of years ago. Despite that he hasn't missed any starts and although he's played the left side most of his career he's also moved around when needed.
Josh Sitton’s career statistics Games Fumbles Year G GS FF FR 2008 11 2 2009 16 16 0 1 2010 16 16 2011 14 14 2012* 16 16 2013 16 16 2014* 16 16 2015* 16 16 Career 121 112 0 1
He's only missed two starts since 2009. That's some pretty good toughness and consistency I'd say.
Right now the Porker fans seem to be as upset with this move as some Bears fans have been with our release of Matt Slauson. I'm not sure Sitton is the perfect prospect for a zone run blocking scheme either but the guy is a virtual wall as a pass blocker so in any event I don't think we can ignore any opportunities to sign him. His knowledge of the GB offense is an X factor in the whole deal too.
I also hope Pace can get a deal done with him before he even leaves to NOLA. I think we have more to offer him now and in the near future than virtually anyone else. If he can play OC or this other FA we just picked up can maybe we set Larsen sailing.
Post by Whisky Beer Bob on Sept 4, 2016 17:18:01 GMT -6
I can't fault Pace for letting Slauson go. Again if he knew we would have the injury and retirement I am sure he would not have let him go. Pace has done reasonably well since coming to Chicago and he has a vision. I know Emery had 1 before him and so on but this is what we got so we might as well get on board and enjoy the ride. I love wine,beer, and whiskey. So does Pace(alcohol induced speculation of course.) So cheers bro, Bear down, and let's get that Super Bowl win!!! This is the closest post to jackiejokemans legendary posts we have so like it up, shoot tha booze, and Bear Down