For what it's worth, I have followed your logic and agree 100%. No team loses 20 players to IR without being crippled. This isn't rocket-science, it's football-101 stuff.
Thank you JABF...sometimes I feel like I'm shouting into the wind here.
We are all understandably frustrated and venting. Me too. This is a very painful season for the fans. I think many of us want to over-simplify the reason for the crappy season we've had. In reality I think it resulted from a number of factors. It is not as simple as firing Fox and all of a sudden things are rosy here. We fired Lovie Smith after a 10-win season and figured it was all "good" - but no joy yet.
10 of them are starters on this team, and a few more were active role player....but yeah...most of em were irrelevant...sure.
Come on dude, just because they are starters on this shitty team doesn't mean they're actually worth anything. Most of them would never make it on other teams.
Let's see the IR list:
76 Mike Adams T (IR) - irrelevant 88 Rory Anderson TE (IR) - who? 71 Nick Becton OT (IR) - irrelevant 22 Brandon Boykin CB (IR) - irrelevant 6 Jay Cutler QB (IR) - important 95 Ego Ferguson DE (IR) - irrelevant 23 Kyle Fuller CB (IR) - somewhat important 55 Hroniss Grasu C (IR) - somewhat important 99 Lamarr Houston OLB (IR) - important 2 Brian Hoyer QB (IR) - irrelevant 45 Roy Robertson-Harris OLB (IR) - irrelevant 75 Kyle Long G (IR) - very important 43 Danny Mason ILB (IR) - who? 86 Zach Miller TE (IR) - somewhat important 19 Eddie Royal WR (IR) - irrelevant 8 Connor Shaw QB (IR) - irrelevant 93 Will Sutton NT (IR) - irrelevant 59 Danny Trevathan ILB (IR) - important 13 Kevin White WR (IR) first round bust - irrelevant 10 Marquess Wilson WR (IR) - can't play an entire ****ing game without getting hurt - irrelevant
13 put of 20 players on IR are irrelevant. So basically we only have seven real players on IR, which is NO excuse or reason for that pathetic record.
Thank you lb. It does look much different when we look at the actual facts behind the numbers. But even this doesn't excuse the consistent mental breakdowns and lousy execution on the part of players who been playing their positions some as long ago as in HS.
I played a lot of baseball and fast pitch softball as a catcher and an outfielder. I could make a throw to 2nd base and hit a cut off man when I was in little league so why can't a 22 or 23 year old pro make a tackle or catch a pass that hits him right in the numbers? It's not the injuries it's the uninjured who aren't performing who are costing us big time.
Thank you JABF...sometimes I feel like I'm shouting into the wind here.
We are all understandably frustrated and venting. Me too. This is a very painful season for the fans. I think many of us want to over-simplify the reason for the crappy season we've had. In reality I think it resulted from a number of factors. It is not as simple as firing Fox and all of a sudden things are rosy here. We fired Lovie Smith after a 10-win season and figured it was all "good" - but no joy yet.
It's been nearly 30 years with very little joy so I hope it's OK if I save my party poppers and balloons for another day. Injuries can only get you so much relief when the lack of discipline and execution by the uninjured are so poor and even the HC admits it's lacking.
You know, we've had injuries all season long and so have others but players learn to step up from the ranks and play like starters on good teams. Ours haven't. So to me this injury thing is wearing as thin as constant whining about being beaten by the refs. To me that's all it is.
We are all understandably frustrated and venting. Me too. This is a very painful season for the fans. I think many of us want to over-simplify the reason for the crappy season we've had. In reality I think it resulted from a number of factors. It is not as simple as firing Fox and all of a sudden things are rosy here. We fired Lovie Smith after a 10-win season and figured it was all "good" - but no joy yet.
It's been nearly 30 years with very little joy so I hope it's OK if I save my party poppers and balloons for another day. Injuries can only get you so much relief when the lack of discipline and execution by the uninjured are so poor and even the HC admits it's lacking.
You know, we've had injuries all season long and so have others but players learn to step up from the ranks and play like starters on good teams. Ours haven't. So to me this injury thing is wearing as thin as constant whining about being beaten by the refs. To me that's all it is.
Some of our backup players HAVE stepped up. Some though, just don't have the talent. If you put a gun to their head they couldn't perform better due to the fact they just don't have the talent. Fans may not want to believe that. But some backup players will never be starter quality players.
Fans want to over-simplify. Fire this guy. Cut that guy. Draft this guy. And it's super bowl here we come, baby. LOL.
Yes, injuries are one factor in a complex equation. Here are just a few factors that come off the top of my head. It isn't meant to be all-encompassing. The winning equation includes:
1. Player talent on the roster. 2. Players who fit the schemes a coach is trying to run. 3. Player talent on gameday (minus injured key players). 4. Head Coaching talent. 5. Coordinator talent. 6 Quality schemes and play calling. 7. Positional coaching talent (just look at the job Dave Magazu has done this year with our OL). 8. Scouting department talent (evaluating draftees and FA's well) 9. GM talent (is the guy putting the highest quality players and coaches on the team - or not?) 10.Quality ownership (this is a billion-dollar entity run by a family... are they putting the best quality execs in place to run it?). 11.Quality leadership in the executive positions (George McCaskey & Ted Philips).
No, injuries are not an excuse, but they ARE a factor. One of many factors. You don't randomly dismiss ANY factors in the franchise equation. But of course fans (ignorant fans... not you Soul, but some others) dismiss it all as a 1-factor problem (Fox, injuries, whatever). No. It is a complex equation. But yes, injuries ARE a significant factor. Only an idiot would dismiss the injury level we have experienced this season. We lead the NFL in only 1 category this season - injured players.
A championship NFL team is made up of a lot of "quality" factors. All are important.
Yes, that injury factor is a significant factor. But one of many. Not an excuse.
It's been nearly 30 years with very little joy so I hope it's OK if I save my party poppers and balloons for another day. Injuries can only get you so much relief when the lack of discipline and execution by the uninjured are so poor and even the HC admits it's lacking.
You know, we've had injuries all season long and so have others but players learn to step up from the ranks and play like starters on good teams. Ours haven't. So to me this injury thing is wearing as thin as constant whining about being beaten by the refs. To me that's all it is.
Some of our backup players HAVE stepped up. Some though, just don't have the talent. If you put a gun to their head they couldn't perform better due to the fact they just don't have the talent. Fans may not want to believe that. But some backup players will never be starter quality players.
Fans want to over-simplify. Fire this guy. Cut that guy. Draft this guy. And it's super bowl here we come, baby. LOL.
Yes, injuries are one factor in a complex equation. Here are just a few factors that come off the top of my head. It isn't meant to be all-encompassing. The winning equation includes:
1. Player talent on the roster. 2. Players who fit the schemes a coach is trying to run. 3. Player talent on gameday (minus injured key players). 4. Head Coaching talent. 5. Coordinator talent. 6 Quality schemes and play calling. 7. Positional coaching talent (just look at the job Dave Magazu has done this year with our OL). 8. Scouting department talent (evaluating draftees and FA's well) 9. GM talent (is the guy putting the highest quality players and coaches on the team - or not?) 10.Quality ownership (this is a billion-dollar entity run by a family... are they putting the best quality execs in place to run it?). 11.Quality leadership in the executive positions (George McCaskey & Ted Philips).
No, injuries are not an excuse, but they ARE a factor. One of many factors. You don't randomly dismiss ANY factors in the franchise equation. But of course fans (ignorant fans... not you Soul, but some others) dismiss it all as a 1-factor problem (Fox, injuries, whatever). No. It is a complex equation. But yes, injuries ARE a significant factor. Only an idiot would dismiss the injury level we have experienced this season. We lead the NFL in only 1 category this season - injured players.
A championship NFL team is made up of a lot of "quality" factors. All are important.
Yes, that injury factor is a significant factor. But one of many. Not an excuse.
Is it lack of talent or is it lack of execution? Fox himself says it's the latter so why debate it?
It's not that I don't believe some of the players they've needed to play don't fall short in the talent department but all 22 don't and many of those players have received kudos for having played quite well at other times or other games. Case in point. Crevon LeBlanc has been credited as a great pickup by Pace yet he gave up a 60 yard bomb that resulted in the loss to GB. Nick Kwiatkoski has gotten some great reviews as well but has also been on the field when we got trampled in the run game. IMHO both are very talented players who failed to execute well.
So we have inconsistency from game to game as a factor too but then that also is true of the coaching staff as well. In very few games have the Bears begun the game looking well prepared for the other team and all but one they've either failed to play 60 minutes of football or make the in game adjustments needed to stay in to win a game. All I'm saying is let's not keep discounting these things which has been very obvious all year and keep playing the injury card OK?
Grizz (lb) even took that time to review those on the IR and assign them a grade as far as the relevance of losing them and once we look at those facts we can easily see that less than half those injuries have been to players who are or have in the past been critical to the teams success. Some are still here ONLY because they're on the IR and can't be released so it's really not 19 or 20 critical injuries it's half that number or less. Maybe the most damaging is the loss of Cutler yet he's still the guy many want to dump so how serious do we take even that.
No one has said that the injuries count for nothing but then there are those who want to play them like they're trips Aces when it's more like they're a pair of Jacks. I think most of us are gonna look at this they way we do and that's that. I don't expect everyone to see it my way but then it is the way I see it. When a team is still this lacking in discipline and execution in game 15 of a season IMHO it's not just a lack of talent. It's also a lack of good coaching and accountability and I've pointed out before that this was an issue with Fox that followed him here from Denver so it really shouldn't be a shock to anyone and it isn't to me.
Some of our backup players HAVE stepped up. Some though, just don't have the talent. If you put a gun to their head they couldn't perform better due to the fact they just don't have the talent. Fans may not want to believe that. But some backup players will never be starter quality players.
Fans want to over-simplify. Fire this guy. Cut that guy. Draft this guy. And it's super bowl here we come, baby. LOL.
Yes, injuries are one factor in a complex equation. Here are just a few factors that come off the top of my head. It isn't meant to be all-encompassing. The winning equation includes:
1. Player talent on the roster. 2. Players who fit the schemes a coach is trying to run. 3. Player talent on gameday (minus injured key players). 4. Head Coaching talent. 5. Coordinator talent. 6 Quality schemes and play calling. 7. Positional coaching talent (just look at the job Dave Magazu has done this year with our OL). 8. Scouting department talent (evaluating draftees and FA's well) 9. GM talent (is the guy putting the highest quality players and coaches on the team - or not?) 10.Quality ownership (this is a billion-dollar entity run by a family... are they putting the best quality execs in place to run it?). 11.Quality leadership in the executive positions (George McCaskey & Ted Philips).
No, injuries are not an excuse, but they ARE a factor. One of many factors. You don't randomly dismiss ANY factors in the franchise equation. But of course fans (ignorant fans... not you Soul, but some others) dismiss it all as a 1-factor problem (Fox, injuries, whatever). No. It is a complex equation. But yes, injuries ARE a significant factor. Only an idiot would dismiss the injury level we have experienced this season. We lead the NFL in only 1 category this season - injured players.
A championship NFL team is made up of a lot of "quality" factors. All are important.
Yes, that injury factor is a significant factor. But one of many. Not an excuse.
Is it lack of talent or is it lack of execution? Fox himself says it's the latter so why debate it?
It's not that I don't believe some of the players they've needed to play don't fall short in the talent department but all 22 don't and many of those players have received kudos for having played quite well at other times or other games. Case in point. Crevon LeBlanc has been credited as a great pickup by Pace yet he gave up a 60 yard bomb that resulted in the loss to GB. Nick Kwiatkoski has gotten some great reviews as well but has also been on the field when we got trampled in the run game. IMHO both are very talented players who failed to execute well.
So we have inconsistency from game to game as a factor too but then that also is true of the coaching staff as well. In very few games have the Bears begun the game looking well prepared for the other team and all but one they've either failed to play 60 minutes of football or make the in game adjustments needed to stay in to win a game. All I'm saying is let's not keep discounting these things which has been very obvious all year and keep playing the injury card OK?
Grizz (lb) even took that time to review those on the IR and assign them a grade as far as the relevance of losing them and once we look at those facts we can easily see that less than half those injuries have been to players who are or have in the past been critical to the teams success. Some are still here ONLY because they're on the IR and can't be released so it's really not 19 or 20 critical injuries it's half that number or less. Maybe the most damaging is the loss of Cutler yet he's still the guy many want to dump so how serious do we take even that.
No one has said that the injuries count for nothing but then there are those who want to play them like they're trips Aces when it's more like they're a pair of Jacks. I think most of us are gonna look at this they way we do and that's that. I don't expect everyone to see it my way but then it is the way I see it. When a team is still this lacking in discipline and execution in game 15 of a season IMHO it's not just a lack of talent. It's also a lack of good coaching and accountability and I've pointed out before that this was an issue with Fox that followed him here from Denver so it really shouldn't be a shock to anyone and it isn't to me.
Lack of talent and lack of execution are not mutually exclusive entities, IMHO. You do realize Fox can't come out and say the talent sucks, right? Our talent has issues, even before you factor in the injuries. LOL, we have a ton of issues. But injuries are one. No sane coach wants 20 or more players on IR. And we have had a lot of injuries that did not end up as IRed players.
And one other point (and this is not directed at you, but at many fans in general) it is a pet-peeve of mine when fans over-simplify a complex problem. They will hone in on one thing (e.g., just "get rid of Cutler" and that's our problem). Good luck with that. Because many things are a lot more complex than how people believe - and that applies to football too. Fire this guy. Cut that player. LOL, and it will all be "good" here.
But yes, injuries have been one of many issues that hurt the team this season.
Is it lack of talent or is it lack of execution? Fox himself says it's the latter so why debate it?
It's not that I don't believe some of the players they've needed to play don't fall short in the talent department but all 22 don't and many of those players have received kudos for having played quite well at other times or other games. Case in point. Crevon LeBlanc has been credited as a great pickup by Pace yet he gave up a 60 yard bomb that resulted in the loss to GB. Nick Kwiatkoski has gotten some great reviews as well but has also been on the field when we got trampled in the run game. IMHO both are very talented players who failed to execute well.
So we have inconsistency from game to game as a factor too but then that also is true of the coaching staff as well. In very few games have the Bears begun the game looking well prepared for the other team and all but one they've either failed to play 60 minutes of football or make the in game adjustments needed to stay in to win a game. All I'm saying is let's not keep discounting these things which has been very obvious all year and keep playing the injury card OK?
Grizz (lb) even took that time to review those on the IR and assign them a grade as far as the relevance of losing them and once we look at those facts we can easily see that less than half those injuries have been to players who are or have in the past been critical to the teams success. Some are still here ONLY because they're on the IR and can't be released so it's really not 19 or 20 critical injuries it's half that number or less. Maybe the most damaging is the loss of Cutler yet he's still the guy many want to dump so how serious do we take even that.
No one has said that the injuries count for nothing but then there are those who want to play them like they're trips Aces when it's more like they're a pair of Jacks. I think most of us are gonna look at this they way we do and that's that. I don't expect everyone to see it my way but then it is the way I see it. When a team is still this lacking in discipline and execution in game 15 of a season IMHO it's not just a lack of talent. It's also a lack of good coaching and accountability and I've pointed out before that this was an issue with Fox that followed him here from Denver so it really shouldn't be a shock to anyone and it isn't to me.
Lack of talent and lack of execution are not mutually exclusive entities, IMHO. You do realize Fox can't come out and say the talent sucks, right? Our talent has issues, even before you factor in the injuries. LOL, we have a ton of issues. But injuries are one. No sane coach wants 20 or more players on IR. And we have had a lot of injuries that did not end up as IRed players.
And one other point (and this is not directed at you, but at many fans in general) it is a pet-peeve of mine when fans over-simplify a complex problem. They will hone in on one thing (e.g., just "get rid of Cutler" and that's our problem). Good luck with that. Because many things are a lot more complex than how people believe - and that applies to football too. Fire this guy. Cut that player. LOL, and it will all be "good" here.
But yes, injuries have been one of many issues that hurt the team this season.
Yep...just fire the coach and all of a sudden we'll be able to win with a 4th string QB, and shitty secondary and 20 players on IR, who even though they may suck, were good enough for many of them to either be starters or major contributors to this team, so they're level of skill is irrelevant to what they could do on other teams. They started or played major minutes for THIS team, meaning they were better than their replacements, who were then asked to come in and somehow be magically better than the guy in front of them. I'm really having a hard time wrapping my brain around these ridiculous expectations.
Lack of talent and lack of execution are not mutually exclusive entities, IMHO. You do realize Fox can't come out and say the talent sucks, right? Our talent has issues, even before you factor in the injuries. LOL, we have a ton of issues. But injuries are one. No sane coach wants 20 or more players on IR. And we have had a lot of injuries that did not end up as IRed players.
And one other point (and this is not directed at you, but at many fans in general) it is a pet-peeve of mine when fans over-simplify a complex problem. They will hone in on one thing (e.g., just "get rid of Cutler" and that's our problem). Good luck with that. Because many things are a lot more complex than how people believe - and that applies to football too. Fire this guy. Cut that player. LOL, and it will all be "good" here.
But yes, injuries have been one of many issues that hurt the team this season.
Yep...just fire the coach and all of a sudden we'll be able to win with a 4th string QB, and shitty secondary and 20 players on IR, who even though they may suck, were good enough for many of them to either be starters or major contributors to this team, so they're level of skill is irrelevant to what they could do on other teams. They started or played major minutes for THIS team, meaning they were better than their replacements, who were then asked to come in and somehow be magically better than the guy in front of them. I'm really having a hard time wrapping my brain around these ridiculous expectations.
You just need a cup of JABFs new protein coffee. It's like brain food. You will be able to understand anything.
Yep...just fire the coach and all of a sudden we'll be able to win with a 4th string QB, and shitty secondary and 20 players on IR, who even though they may suck, were good enough for many of them to either be starters or major contributors to this team, so they're level of skill is irrelevant to what they could do on other teams. They started or played major minutes for THIS team, meaning they were better than their replacements, who were then asked to come in and somehow be magically better than the guy in front of them. I'm really having a hard time wrapping my brain around these ridiculous expectations.
You just need a cup of JABFs new protein coffee. It's like brain food. You will be able to understand anything.