I know there was a lot of blowback about the Bears drafting Caleb Williams. Are you still feeling that way or are you beginning to like the idea of drafting him?
Post by weneedmorelinemen on Jan 16, 2024 21:29:10 GMT -6
I don't know enough about judging quarterback talent, so all I can do is hope the front office makes the right guess. If they traded Fields and take Caleb, they better be right. If Poles trades for a boatload of picks, and Fields fails while Caleb goes on the the HOF, he will be judged for that too.
I've seen what happens before when the Bears take the "consensus best pick" with Cedric Benson when the Bears had a capable running back on the roster.
I've also watched them pass up Aaron Rodgers to keep Rex Grossman because they didn't know his full potential, and the journey of discovery they underwent was that Rex is a journeyman QB.
Heck, even the Rex Grossman situation was from the Bears trading down the #4 overall pick to get Michael Haynes and Rex Grossman. Trade downs don't always get you the good value.
What I guess my answer is, I don't hate the idea of Caleb Williams being a Bear. I just struggle with the fear that he will get the Cedric Benson treatment and be outside the team while he struggles to win, and jump ship as soon as he can.
I know there was a lot of blowback about the Bears drafting Caleb Williams. Are you still feeling that way or are you beginning to like the idea of drafting him?
My thinking has always started with the idea that MHJ is Randy Moss 2.0 and that with him plus your chosen center and a competent OC, Fields will be “good enough” or even better. I see that as a viable path to a Super Bowl ready offense by 2025.
So why risk drafting a QB? There is the financial argument that a new QB creates a wider window. Chris Long has an answer. Over the next two years, there’s only about $13M difference between what you have to pay Fields vs. the new QB. By then, you know for sure whether Fields is worth an extension.
In the end, I think Poles will feel compelled to draft Williams to avoid the possibility of having it on his tombstone that he passed on two super star QBs and never won a Super Bowl, while both of them did. That’s keeping him awake at night.
I started warming about 1/2 way through the season on a rookie qb, CWill or otherwise. I was 100% sold on it by dec, just in time to see JF finally look like an NFL qb in week 16; and then fall back into what he's been most of the year against GB.
Hated what they did to him. Just like Mitch, started to soon, w/a staff and offense around him incapable of supporting a young qb. Changed coaches and both times still did the Bears minimum on O and continued to act like a young qb could establish themselves w/nothing. Stroud is a Unicorn, that doesn't happen normally, and you cannot expect it to as a GM/HC.
Get a new QB under a rookie deal and if he doesn't work, do it again. You cannot pay mid qb's 30-40-50 mil and expect to build a team that can win in the playoffs, see Dal and Dak, again. Dak is my closing argument on paying mid qb's franchise money bc "thats the market". Ignoring that good investors don't buy into inflated markets b/c it's a surefire way to lose. You buy in suppressed markets and you sell in high markets. You trade a guy like Goff or JF(hopefully) and get way more than they are worth and get a qb on a rookie deal until you find that guy like Mahomes or Stroud.
I started warming about 1/2 way through the season on a rookie qb, CWill or otherwise. I was 100% sold on it by dec, just in time to see JF finally look like an NFL qb in week 16; and then fall back into what he's been most of the year against GB.
Hated what they did to him. Just like Mitch, started to soon, w/a staff and offense around him incapable of supporting a young qb. Changed coaches and both times still did the Bears minimum on O and continued to act like a young qb could establish themselves w/nothing. Stroud is a Unicorn, that doesn't happen normally, and you cannot expect it to as a GM/HC.
Get a new QB under a rookie deal and if he doesn't work, do it again. You cannot pay mid qb's 30-40-50 mil and expect to build a team that can win in the playoffs, see Dal and Dak, again. Dak is my closing argument on paying mid qb's franchise money bc "thats the market". Ignoring that good investors don't buy into inflated markets b/c it's a surefire way to lose. You buy in suppressed markets and you sell in high markets. You trade a guy like Goff or JF(hopefully) and get way more than they are worth and get a qb on a rookie deal until you find that guy like Mahomes or Stroud.
Poles would be paying Fields LESS than a new QB in 2024. If he plays as badly as you guys predict, then screw it. Let him go FA or trade. But if we’re looking near Super Bowl ready in 2024, go ahead with the 5th year option in 2025. By then, we know his true ceiling because we have seen two years of playoff games. If he looks like Dak in those games, he gets NO big extension. Seems to me this meets your concerns.
I am warming to drafting a QB. Part of me would like to keep Fields and let new QB sit for the year. Then you get into trade value and does another year help or hurt trade value. The trade off between WR Marvin Harrison vs Odunze or Nabors if Avail. Taking Qb first and need for WR probably means you miss out on a top DE. Taking a QB probably requires signing a top Free Agent at DE or WR. Starting to think if you could trade down to second or third pick and get future First then hope LSU QB avail with pick 9 and get Harrison.
I watched 2 USC games this year, Notre Dame and Washinton. Turns out these were 2 of Williams worse games of the year. Needless to say I was not impressed. Then you see stats where Trubiskey rated higher than Fields and having seen Trubiskey post Besrs and it is easier to trade Fields. I just have no confidence the Bears won't screw up whatever they do. Exciting but sad, keeping Eberflus just screws up everything in my mind, we need an offensive HC for stability.
I started warming about 1/2 way through the season on a rookie qb, CWill or otherwise. I was 100% sold on it by dec, just in time to see JF finally look like an NFL qb in week 16; and then fall back into what he's been most of the year against GB.
Hated what they did to him. Just like Mitch, started to soon, w/a staff and offense around him incapable of supporting a young qb. Changed coaches and both times still did the Bears minimum on O and continued to act like a young qb could establish themselves w/nothing. Stroud is a Unicorn, that doesn't happen normally, and you cannot expect it to as a GM/HC.
Get a new QB under a rookie deal and if he doesn't work, do it again. You cannot pay mid qb's 30-40-50 mil and expect to build a team that can win in the playoffs, see Dal and Dak, again. Dak is my closing argument on paying mid qb's franchise money bc "thats the market". Ignoring that good investors don't buy into inflated markets b/c it's a surefire way to lose. You buy in suppressed markets and you sell in high markets. You trade a guy like Goff or JF(hopefully) and get way more than they are worth and get a qb on a rookie deal until you find that guy like Mahomes or Stroud.
Poles would be paying Fields LESS than a new QB in 2024. If he plays as badly as you guys predict, then screw it. Let him go FA or trade. But if we’re looking near Super Bowl ready in 2024, go ahead with the 5th year option in 2025. By then, we know his true ceiling because we have seen two years of playoff games. If he looks like Dak in those games, he gets NO big extension. Seems to me this meets your concerns.
and by the time that new qb was in his 3rd year significantly less then JF if he's still here. Stop being you.
I am warming to drafting a QB. Part of me would like to keep Fields and let new QB sit for the year. Then you get into trade value and does another year help or hurt trade value. The trade off between WR Marvin Harrison vs Odunze or Nabors if Avail. Taking Qb first and need for WR probably means you miss out on a top DE. Taking a QB probably requires signing a top Free Agent at DE or WR. Starting to think if you could trade down to second or third pick and get future First then hope LSU QB avail with pick 9 and get Harrison.
I watched 2 USC games this year, Notre Dame and Washinton. Turns out these were 2 of Williams worse games of the year. Needless to say I was not impressed. Then you see stats where Trubiskey rated higher than Fields and having seen Trubiskey post Besrs and it is easier to trade Fields. I just have no confidence the Bears won't screw up whatever they do. Exciting but sad, keeping Eberflus just screws up everything in my mind, we need an offensive HC for stability.
We still have DJ Moore, he's more than capable of being a #1. What the team needs is a real 2 or 3, something they haven't had on the team since Marshal and Jeffery, and before that, probably the 90's.
I never liked the Flus hire, for the very reason you stated, imo you need an O minded HC to help develop a qb. But you have to stop the bleeding of starting over every 4-5 years. I hope Poles/Warren are going to give him 3 more years; he was a young HC he was learning and his first year was literally the GM tearing it all down(Fields also) and there was no way this year was going to be good. Same for the GM really.
If the team is going to insist in bringing in inexperienced people to run the team, they have to give them time to screw up and learn and show growth. Poles/Flus did that; Fields hasn't. But 100% agree that history states the Bears will blow this regardless of what they do; but if Det and the Browns can figure it out, so can the Bears.
Post by bearsfaninaz on Jan 17, 2024 8:19:24 GMT -6
Please no. He will be a bust. He's a smaller Fields. One read then panic imo. Also I don't want Eberflus to get a new QB then we start the coaching cycle all over again the following season leaving us at the same spot we've been in since Cutler
Personally, I don't care...I'd prefer to roll with Fields, draft blue chippers and reload next year. Other disagree and I can't argue with drafting a QB and dropping him into a team that looks close to starting its roll.
But...here's a few videos that are pro-Williams. Remember the infamous Watson video that a poster pushed as the reasons to not draft Watson (couldn't throw the deep ball and was inaccurate in general)? All these videos show cherry picked plays to prove the point, so don't kill the messenger.
