In the organizational chart, doesn’t Poles report to Warren? So, if he determines that Poles F’ed up the “rebuild”, is it not Warren’s responsibility to fire him and find a new GM? Okay, he’s been focused on the new stadium, but a CEO needs to wear more than one hat, especially if this degenerates into another clown show like we’ve seen the first two games.
Wait, I thought we were talking about you saying you would fire Warren!? Im confused.
Im sure Poles will be on the rather thin line. He promised us taking over the North and reign, so far looks like we will be taking over the bottom, and stayin there.
I said that IF he was significantly involved in this “rebuild “ decisions in free agency, draft, etc. in full partnership with Poles, then his judgment on roster decisions is no better than Poles’, and therefore deserves to be fired together.
On the other hand, if he was preoccupied with new stadium and trusted Poles to manage the roster, then he is less responsible for what has happened. But now that we are here, it nonetheless his responsibility to review Poles’ job performance and act accordingly as the CEO of the organization.
Post by paytonisgod on Sept 18, 2023 10:44:32 GMT -6
I've seen enough of Fields. I had some hope for him after a stretch last year. I wish this all were otherwise but he just isn't getting any better. All this stuff about OCs not using him right, lack of "innovative playcalling," or "they ruined him," is just cope. Plenty of QBs have lesser weapons and weak OCs and can still perform better than this.
He can't seem to make simple throws other QBs make regularly.
He never throws with anticipation.
All his completions were to guys wide open where he was still a half second late or more in throwing it.
He displays little to no pocket presence and continues to act like he has all day back there, when he should know he needs to get it out quickly.
He seems to alternate between being too timid and too reckless.
There are certainly other factors in these losses. For one I'm starting to think we may have some very poor overall coaching. Or we may just have a real lack of talent in a number of areas. But Fields is the #1 problem. Unfortunately we're going to have the rest of the year to see that. That is unless the coaching staff's self-preservation instinct kicks in mid season and they just bench him.
Now that you mention Warren, he was supposedly the football genius that McCaskey brought in to oversee Poles so that George himself can be more hands off on player decisions. Assuming Warren actually had significant role in the decisions, then I’d fire him, too, and bring in some other football genius CEO. If the top of the franchise is incompetent, it all flows downhill from there. George can’t be fired, so we can only hope he gets lucky next round.
He’s due!
What da hell are you talking about!? Didnt we hire Warren this year?
It's crazy talk as we all are frustrated. Warren was brought in to manage the stadium project. I doubt he had anything to do with personnel beneath him. There's zero chance he's fired nor would that do any good anyway.
Getting back to the key questions, which are a failing OC and a failing QB, the situation is as follows:
Fields is being coached/asked to do a lot of traditional pocket passer stuff like recognize coverages, make multiple reads in a progression, etc., etc. And he sucks at it. He sucks BAD. As JABF pointed out, he's way too SLLLLLOOOOOWWWWWWWWWWW and clearly doesn't understand what he's seeing. There's times when he isn't seeing the field at all. He has multiple plays every game where receivers are wide-ass-open by NFL standards calling for the ball and Fields doesn't get it to them. Yesterday there was a play multiple analysts pointed out where DJ Moore was all alone facing directly at Fields and actually CLAPPING HIS HANDS to get the ball and Fields still f'd it up. The tweet I posed above is an easy touchdown for a high school QB and Fields turned it into a sack. He turns lots of stuff into unnecessary sacks. He's freakin' awful in terms of his mental processing and internal clock. Even Mitch wasn't this bad.
Getsy OTOH could adjust his scheme to turn Fields loose, let him run (he had 3 yards rushing yesterday), and play a schoolyard type of ball mostly outside the pocket. That's what happened last year after the Washington TNF debacle. They did that and the O caught fire, scoring almost 30 pts/game for a stretch during midseason. Problem is, the Bears only won 1 of those games (New England) despite Fields playing hero ball and defenses later adjusted and shut down the explosive plays late in the year (the O stopped scoring again the last 3-4 weeks of the season).
So what do you do? You could say screw it and turn to Plan B which will probably make us all feel better in the short-term but is that sustainable in the long run?
Getsy is impossible to defend as a fan. He's been a total clown college as an OC. The guy only knows 6 plays and 4 of them are screens. It was a horrible playcall for that situation and they go to that well sooooo many times each game that smart defensive players on the other side start sniffing it out.
Having said that, it is clear they don't trust Fields to drop back into the pocket in his end zone and with lots of good reasons. Calling that is almost like conceding the safety cuz Fields would pat the ball 16 times and then run into a sack again.
We had these same discussions over and over in 2019 with Mitch. You could "play to his strengths" which would mean moving pockets, cutting field in half, reducing his read to something simple like one high-low concept, etc. But that isn't sustainable long-term. See Newton, Cam. Eventually you have to deliver the ball accurately from the pocket properly reading the defense in 2.5 seconds or less and neither Fields nor Mitch can do that.
I've seen enough of Fields. I had some hope for him after a stretch last year. I wish this all were otherwise but he just isn't getting any better. All this stuff about OCs not using him right, lack of "innovative playcalling," or "they ruined him," is just cope. Plenty of QBs have lesser weapons and weak OCs and can still perform better than this.
He can't seem to make simple throws other QBs make regularly.
He never throws with anticipation.
All his completions were to guys wide open where he was still a half second late or more in throwing it.
He displays little to no pocket presence and continues to act like he has all day back there, when he should know he needs to get it out quickly.
He seems to alternate between being too timid and too reckless.
There are certainly other factors in these losses. For one I'm starting to think we may have some very poor overall coaching. Or we may just have a real lack of talent in a number of areas. But Fields is the #1 problem. Unfortunately we're going to have the rest of the year to see that. That is unless the coaching staff's self-preservation instinct kicks in mid season and they just bench him.
I agree. Every one of your bullet points is spot on. I'm not absolving Getsy one bit as he blows as an OC but ultimately franchise QBs overcome obstacles and elevate those around them.
Fields is de-elevating those around him. Mooney got zero targets yesterday. A thousand yard receiver who was your best player in week 1 got zero touches.
If/when we get to the point where we are again out of the postseason picture and Poles has concluded he's not sticking with Fields going forward, I suspect he will tell Flus to play Bagent a few games to see what you have/don't have in him. We still have a lot more losing to do first.
What da hell are you talking about!? Didnt we hire Warren this year?
It's crazy talk as we all are frustrated. Warren was brought in to manage the stadium project. I doubt he had anything to do with personnel beneath him. There's zero chance he's fired nor would that do any good anyway.
Getting back to the key questions, which are a failing OC and a failing QB, the situation is as follows:
Fields is being coached/asked to do a lot of traditional pocket passer stuff like recognize coverages, make multiple reads in a progression, etc., etc. And he sucks at it. He sucks BAD. As JABF pointed out, he's way too SLLLLLOOOOOWWWWWWWWWWW and clearly doesn't understand what he's seeing. There's times when he isn't seeing the field at all. He has multiple plays every game where receivers are wide-ass-open by NFL standards calling for the ball and Fields doesn't get it to them. Yesterday there was a play multiple analysts pointed out where DJ Moore was all alone facing directly at Fields and actually CLAPPING HIS HANDS to get the ball and Fields still f'd it up. The tweet I posed above is an easy touchdown for a high school QB and Fields turned it into a sack. He turns lots of stuff into unnecessary sacks. He's freakin' awful in terms of his mental processing and internal clock. Even Mitch wasn't this bad.
Getsy OTOH could adjust his scheme to turn Fields loose, let him run (he had 3 yards rushing yesterday), and play a schoolyard type of ball mostly outside the pocket. That's what happened last year after the Washington TNF debacle. They did that and the O caught fire, scoring almost 30 pts/game for a stretch during midseason. Problem is, the Bears only won 1 of those games (New England) despite Fields playing hero ball and defenses later adjusted and shut down the explosive plays late in the year (the O stopped scoring again the last 3-4 weeks of the season).
So what do you do? You could say screw it and turn to Plan B which will probably make us all feel better in the short-term but is that sustainable in the long run?
Fields is clearly failing in Plan A
What QB's have less and are outperforming him? I'm interested and waiting on baited breath. Not saying Fields could have or would have ever developed regardless, we'll never know. But part of the problem is the bears gave him no chance to ever know.
So what do you do? You could say screw it and turn to Plan B which will probably make us all feel better in the short-term but is that sustainable in the long run?
Fields is clearly failing in Plan A
I don't honestly know what you do for the remaining season. Maybe let him run like last year in hopes that he would look good enough that you could trade him. I don't think you'd get much. But anything helps. He is not a fit for the Gesty offense (seriously I'm thinking no QB is... maybe a Hall of Famer like Aaron Rodgers and an offense loaded with talent) - but perhaps another NFL coach would feel like they could use him - maybe as a backup even.
We're all angry and disappointed as to how this all turned out. This season was supposed to be all about Fields and it has failed. Somehow Fields is worse than he was. How does that even happen?
I figure we can't change what has happened. But hopefully the Bears learn from this (finally, because they haven't in the past) and they are more thoughtful with the next QB they bring in here. They should focus on giving the new kid everything he needs to succeed day-1 when he lands here - coaching, a scheme that fits his talent, solid offensive line and skill positions. No it won't be perfect QB support. No QB gets perfect surrounding support. But the Bears organization has failed our QBs in the past. It makes you angry when you reflect back on it all. Maybe Fields would have failed anyway, even with solid coaching and surrounding talent day-1. But we will never know. My gut feeling is that on another team with better support, Fields would have been a very good QB. But once you mess up a QBs mental gears then he is done. It really is a shame. Can't fix it for Fields. But hopefully the Bears can fix it for the next QB.