I know that. We just need to see what Dell and others do at the combine.
I don’t think Mooney could beat him on those cone drills, but we will never know, because Mooney declined to run them at the combine. I think they are more relevant than straightforward acceleration for a slot receiver precision route runner, which is what I’m looking for.
I think the 40 is pretty much useless. But the 10 and 20 is more valuable to me, especially at receiver. Receivers do more direct running than other positions, but the 10 specifically shows a players ability to accelerate, and Mooney's ability there is elite. Top .2% in the league elite. So Dell would have to run one hell of a cone drill to beat Mooney with Mooney's ability to accelerate.
Mooney has proven experience at the NFL level and experience with Fields. I hope the Bears can make him a long-term piece of our offense. Hopefully Claypool can be a quality long term piece too. I think that this first full season with Fields will reveal that he is a really good asset for Fields and we can extend him. I just wonder how well Dell would be a fit with those two young but experienced NFL receivers we have. Or is Dell a replacement for Mooney? I don't like that at all. I'd like the Bears to focus on a guy who compliments Mooney, not replace him. But maybe I'm not understanding the needs here. How does Dell make the Bears better than what we already have? Not dissing the guy... just trying to understand why we need another Mooney? We have Mooney.
I know that. We just need to see what Dell and others do at the combine.
I don’t think Mooney could beat him on those cone drills, but we will never know, because Mooney declined to run them at the combine. I think they are more relevant than straightforward acceleration for a slot receiver precision route runner, which is what I’m looking for.
I think the 40 is pretty much useless. But the 10 and 20 is more valuable to me, especially at receiver. Receivers do more direct running than other positions, but the 10 specifically shows a players ability to accelerate, and Mooney's ability there is elite. Top .2% in the league elite. So Dell would have to run one hell of a cone drill to beat Mooney with Mooney's ability to accelerate.
I never ran cone drill, but it obviously requires physical abilities beyond straight line acceleration, and Dell looks to me like he would be very good at it, and those abilities are used in precision route running. That’s why they want to see them do those cone drills, not just time how fast they can run 10 yards in a straight line.
I think the 40 is pretty much useless. But the 10 and 20 is more valuable to me, especially at receiver. Receivers do more direct running than other positions, but the 10 specifically shows a players ability to accelerate, and Mooney's ability there is elite. Top .2% in the league elite. So Dell would have to run one hell of a cone drill to beat Mooney with Mooney's ability to accelerate.
Mooney has proven experience at the NFL level and experience with Fields. I hope the Bears can make him a long-term piece of our offense. Hopefully Claypool can be a quality long term piece too. I think that this first full season with Fields will reveal that he is a really good asset for Fields and we can extend him. I just wonder how well Dell would be a fit with those two young but experienced NFL receivers we have. Or is Dell a replacement for Mooney? I don't like that at all. I'd like the Bears to focus on a guy who compliments Mooney, not replace him. But maybe I'm not understanding the needs here. How does Dell make the Bears better than what we already have? Not dissing the guy... just trying to understand why we need another Mooney? We have Mooney.
Kind of all depends how they use them. If they had Dell, I'd imagine they'd move him and Mooney around the formations to get match up's they want and perhaps to play them off of one another to potentially give a secondary a lot to deal with from a route running aspect. Thankfully thats not for me to figure out! LOL
I think the 40 is pretty much useless. But the 10 and 20 is more valuable to me, especially at receiver. Receivers do more direct running than other positions, but the 10 specifically shows a players ability to accelerate, and Mooney's ability there is elite. Top .2% in the league elite. So Dell would have to run one hell of a cone drill to beat Mooney with Mooney's ability to accelerate.
I never ran cone drill, but it obviously requires physical abilities beyond straight line acceleration, and Dell looks to me like he would be very good at it, and those abilities are used in precision route running. That’s why they want to see them do those cone drills, not just time how fast they can run 10 yards in a straight line.
I gotta be honest, I think the cone drills are pretty useless too. Truth be told, the combine for the most part is a waste of time. You don't find out anything really new about a player that you shouldn't already know. Cone drills involve being able to accelerate, decelerate, and then accelerate again. Thats really the gist of it. Like I said, Mooney's ability to accelerate quickly gives him a pretty good edge.
Either way, those drills are not good at determining how good a route runner a player is, because routes in a game involve defenders and reacting to them, or trying to influence them. The best 3 cone drill in combine history was run by a DB and receiver you've likely never heard of.
I never ran cone drill, but it obviously requires physical abilities beyond straight line acceleration, and Dell looks to me like he would be very good at it, and those abilities are used in precision route running. That’s why they want to see them do those cone drills, not just time how fast they can run 10 yards in a straight line.
I gotta be honest, I think the cone drills are pretty useless too. Truth be told, the combine for the most part is a waste of time. You don't find out anything really new about a player that you shouldn't already know. Cone drills involve being able to accelerate, decelerate, and then accelerate again. Thats really the gist of it. Like I said, Mooney's ability to accelerate quickly gives him a pretty good edge.
Either way, those drills are not good at determining how good a route runner a player is, because routes in a game involve defenders and reacting to them, or trying to influence them. The best 3 cone drill in combine history was run by a DB and receiver you've likely never heard of.
They obviously disagree with you about cone drills, or else they wouldn’t keep doing them. By now, I’d guess the analytics boys have researched whether they have some degree of predictive value. To my eye, it does simulate the movement to make quick cuts when route running. I agree there’s more involved than that in precision route running, but it is one of the elements.
I gotta be honest, I think the cone drills are pretty useless too. Truth be told, the combine for the most part is a waste of time. You don't find out anything really new about a player that you shouldn't already know. Cone drills involve being able to accelerate, decelerate, and then accelerate again. Thats really the gist of it. Like I said, Mooney's ability to accelerate quickly gives him a pretty good edge.
Either way, those drills are not good at determining how good a route runner a player is, because routes in a game involve defenders and reacting to them, or trying to influence them. The best 3 cone drill in combine history was run by a DB and receiver you've likely never heard of.
They obviously disagree with you about cone drills, or else they wouldn’t keep doing them. By now, I’d guess the analytics boys have researched whether they have some degree of predictive value. To my eye, it does simulate the movement to make quick cuts when route running. I agree there’s more involved than that in precision route running, but it is one of the elements.
Trust me...as someone who has trained athletes for the combine and has talked to people in the NFL...they do these things because its what they've always done. Just like a lot of drills in practice don't really help players get better at the position, they're done because they've always been done. So you're half right...they disagree with me, but not because they're right. If you and they were right, every guy who runs a 4.3, or has a sub 7 second 3 cone drill or would play that fast during games...but they don't and thats why you have no idea who Jeff Maehle is.
They obviously disagree with you about cone drills, or else they wouldn’t keep doing them. By now, I’d guess the analytics boys have researched whether they have some degree of predictive value. To my eye, it does simulate the movement to make quick cuts when route running. I agree there’s more involved than that in precision route running, but it is one of the elements.
Trust me...as someone who has trained athletes for the combine and has talked to people in the NFL...they do these things because its what they've always done. Just like a lot of drills in practice don't really help players get better at the position, they're done because they've always been done. So you're half right...they disagree with me, but not because they're right. If you and they were right, every guy who runs a 4.3, or has a sub 7 second 3 cone drill or would play that fast during games...but they don't and thats why you have no idea who Jeff Maehle is.
It will be interesting to see whether Anderson can run the 3-cone as fast as Khalil Mack. This is pretty solid evidence that it does have SOME predictive validity, although obviously imperfect.
Acceleration is only one factor in running fast cone drill. You also have to stop and changes direction fast, which is also a component in precision route running. I looked up Maehle’s combine. He has much less straight line speed and acceleration than Mooney. Other physical skills are required to run fast 3-cone. I still believe Dell would beat Mooney.
Trust me...as someone who has trained athletes for the combine and has talked to people in the NFL...they do these things because its what they've always done. Just like a lot of drills in practice don't really help players get better at the position, they're done because they've always been done. So you're half right...they disagree with me, but not because they're right. If you and they were right, every guy who runs a 4.3, or has a sub 7 second 3 cone drill or would play that fast during games...but they don't and thats why you have no idea who Jeff Maehle is.
It will be interesting to see whether Anderson can run the 3-cone as fast as Khalil Mack. This is pretty solid evidence that it does have SOME predictive validity, although obviously imperfect.
Acceleration is only one factor in running fast cone drill. You also have to stop and changes direction fast, which is also a component in precision route running. I looked up Maehle’s combine. He has much less straight line speed and acceleration than Mooney. Other physical skills are required to run fast 3-cone. I still believe Dell would beat Mooney.
Last I checked receivers were not pass rushers. You don't need to explain what the factors are in the drills...I LITERALLY PREPARE GUYS TO RUN THESE DRILLS FOR THE COMBINE. And when I say literally, I mean that.
It will be interesting to see whether Anderson can run the 3-cone as fast as Khalil Mack. This is pretty solid evidence that it does have SOME predictive validity, although obviously imperfect.
Acceleration is only one factor in running fast cone drill. You also have to stop and changes direction fast, which is also a component in precision route running. I looked up Maehle’s combine. He has much less straight line speed and acceleration than Mooney. Other physical skills are required to run fast 3-cone. I still believe Dell would beat Mooney.
Last I checked receivers were not pass rushers. You don't need to explain what the factors are in the drills...I LITERALLY PREPARE GUYS TO RUN THESE DRILLS FOR THE COMBINE. And when I say literally, I mean that.
1. I don’t know whether there is similar research on WRs. There probably is. But at least for DE, the 3-cone has SOME predictive value.
2. Apparently you think that because Mooney can run fast in a straight line for 10 yards, he would beat Dell in 3-cone. Maehle is pretty slow at 10 yards straight run, but nevertheless ran the fastest ever 3-cone.
3. Edit: post-Super Bowl. Kadarius Toney did a really quick stop and change of direction on his TD catch and again on his big punt return. I thought, “I gotta check his 3-cone time.” It was 6.88. Same as JJ Watt.
Last I checked receivers were not pass rushers. You don't need to explain what the factors are in the drills...I LITERALLY PREPARE GUYS TO RUN THESE DRILLS FOR THE COMBINE. And when I say literally, I mean that.
1. I don’t know whether there is similar research on WRs. There probably is. But at least for DE, the 3-cone has SOME predictive value.
2. Apparently you think that because Mooney can run fast in a straight line for 10 yards, he would beat Dell in 3-cone. Maehle is pretty slow at 10 yards straight run, but nevertheless ran the fastest ever 3-cone.
3. Edit: post-Super Bowl. Kadarius Toney did a really quick stop and change of direction on his TD catch and again on his big punt return. I thought, “I gotta check his 3-cone time.” It was 6.88. Same as JJ Watt.
Some might suggest that Toney can't change direction very well based on that info. Others might say that the skills needed for a good 3 cone drill aren't really that important for a good receiver.
If you look at the drill, the only movements it contains that a receiver would do are a start from a still position(though thats not always the case in a game), and a deceleration into a 90 degree turn with another acceleration. When a receiver is making a cut or going into the break of a route, or using foot work/body gestures to get open they never have to exhibit or use the type of bend or ankle mobility needed to go around the 3rd cone. Pass rushers do though. Thats why largely the time isn't predictive of anything for receivers, which is why more and more of them are not doing the drill at the combine. Its a pointless drill for them, that by and large will do more harm than good for them and their draft prospects. They're wise to spend their time getting faster and working on their actual route running. If Dell has a good agent and team around him, he won't do the 3 cone either.