Post by germansbombedph on Nov 7, 2016 8:20:00 GMT -6
The big question will be, if the McCaskys are willing to fire him after 2 year and pay him. The other question will be the final 8 games. How does the Team look? Do the Players improve and look better? What about the development of our rookies?
Isn't hiring yet another OC that same Problem why you wouldn't fire Fox? Starting that carousel?
A little yes, but the reality is that Loggains doesn't have the resume behind him, and the reality was he was only here b/c he was here, not b/c he was a legitimate candidate. I will say this, if they are keeping Cutler another year then go ahead and keep Loggains. But if you have a new QB, feel free to bring in a legitimate OC that can be here for years w/him.
That seems to make the most sense since the two of them seem to have a good working relationship. But I still want to see what the next 8 games bring before stating anything more than the obvious right now.
We're on a bit of high here coming off one of the best games the Bears have played in the last 4 years and I admit it's easy to get caught up in that. The best thing I can say is that now that we've seen what they can do when they get their shit together there should also be an expectation of more games like that from everyone.
I don't think there's any way to telling who stays and who goes until we get to the last couple of games. By then they will either have recovered enough to possibly finish 8-8 like many picked them to do, they end up worse than that and we pick top ten again, or a miracle happens and we win 7 or all 8 remaining games. If that happens I may start going to church on Sundays again. LOL
To me this why threads about draft position and who do draft are exercises in futility right now. We might as well be trying to predict the weather on the opening day of the draft. We might be just as accurate at that.
But what if so far it's Fox whose been handcuffing Loggains game plans and play calling? We saw a much different approach vs Minny than we saw before that. Plus there are plays and schemes Loggains simply can't run with Hoyer that he can with Cutler.
I want to see what the next 8 games look like before I lay too much of those first 7 at Loggains feet.
People keep saying that they saw something different in Minny, I saw the same play calls. There were a lot of short passes to mid passes, and a few shots down field just like w/Hoyer. The difference was, Cutler got rid of the ball quickly, didn't turn the ball over; and had a really strong running game. He's only thrown 5 passes beyond 21 yards all year(and completed 3 of them per espn splits tab, by pass play section might not have last weeks updated yet). He's not flinging it down field like you guys are acting.
When you look at their breakdowns by pass, Cutler actually has more passes by % behind the LoS 23% to Hoyers 17%, but also less 1-10 yard passes by % 41% to Hoyers 52%. The rest are statistically nil. Both are throwing about 10% of their passes beyond 20 yards.
It's the same gameplan. Cutler has more completed passes there beyond 20 yards, but it's way to small of a sample size(only 5 attempts) to properly judge that, based on last year he's much better at it though, although I don't think anyone is surprised by that. But it's not like that is a major part of the gameplan.
Ric, how can you say that? They ran 29 times against Minny and passed 30 times. Hoyer was throwing nearly 50 passes a game. How is that in any way the same game plan and same play calling. It's not even close brother. Not even close. They ran a very balanced offense against Minny. They never did with Hoyer even when we were still in those games.
The other differences between Cutler and Hoyer having to do with arm strength, distance thrown, trajectory, etc. can only be seen when you watch the two play. They don't show up as well on stats. There is no way anyone can do that and deny that Cutler has the better arm at the very least. I'd also give him the edge in mobility and the ability to throw on the run.
It will be better to have the entire season finished before evaluating players and coaches. I know some have said we should fire Fox this season (mid-season). I don't think that is wise for a number of reasons. One of which is that a top candidate for HC is going to look at that quick-fire as an indicator to go to another team that will give him a fair shot at success. This holds true for coordinators and position coaches. Of course the deadbeat coaches will jump at any job. But if we move on from Fox at some point, I'm hoping we get the best coaching staff here as possible.
It will be better to have the entire season finished before evaluating players and coaches. I know some have said we should fire Fox this season (mid-season). I don't think that is wise for a number of reasons. One of which is that a top candidate for HC is going to look at that quick-fire as an indicator to go to another team that will give him a fair shot at success. This holds true for coordinators and position coaches. Of course the deadbeat coaches will jump at any job. But if we move on from Fox at some point, I'm hoping we get the best coaching staff here as possible.
If the Bears keep firing and hiring coaches they will be like the Browns.
Post by MartianBearsFan on Nov 8, 2016 8:58:44 GMT -6
I think we need to realize something, Trestman was the exception for getting fired after two seasons. He had no control over the locker room and his assistant coaches.
I'm not talking aobut the amount of pass to run plays, i'm talking about the types of passes being thrown..
Distance thrown is what I was talking about in that last post. Where they are throwing is basically the same.
Not exactly. In fact not even close. Cutler has averaged about a yard more per attempt and over 2 more yards per completion than Hoyer. That's major. So they are most definitely not throwing or completing the exact same types of passes.
Hoyer; 7.2 ypa/10.8 ypc Cutler; 8.1 ypa/13.0 ypc
Ric it's easy to get the wrong impressions about the two and it seems many have but once you look at the facts you do see the difference. Now let's see if the running game continues to produce for Cutler like it did against Minny and the differences will be as great or greater.
But even taking all of this away even if the stats were identical no one could argue that Hoyer has the better arm or more mobility than Cutler has. That's not even close either.
I don't think he should be, but I think he will be. No need to start the HC carousel. The team does need a new OC though; Loggains isn't the answer.
Fox needs to stay. The revolving door isn't the answer and I am fairly certain there aren't any prime candidates THAT the Bears can find and lure to take over the team.
Personally, I'd kind of like it if the McKaskeys fire Fox just because they'd have two pay him millions of dollars over the next two years and they'd have to pay millions of dollars to the next coach Chicago fans will run out of town equally fast.
In all seriousness, this Fire Fox talk is insane. The dude was hired for four years, give him an honest chance.
I am, until the end of the season, and I assume so is the front office.
It's tough to sell a turnaround to me unless there actually is one belli.
