Cutler is still better than Hoyer... Mastermind move to confuse the Lions
Well the first is certainly true but since the offense looks the same no matter whose at QB I doubt they'll confuse anyone with anything unless they let us play with 12 or 13 men on both offense and defense. Then we might keep it close.
As long as Cutler is gone next season I don't care who plays this season. Preferably the one who gives us a bigger chance at losing. We really need a top 3 pick.
Well based on Cutler being traded somewhere he can make a difference is probably better for him than us so that's OK with me if they can get fair value for him. But playing to lose so we get a higher pick nope. That's dumb and and no assurance of anything.
Go back over the last 20 years or so and list all of the top ten picks we've had. Now list all of those who've been true difference makers for us. How many did you come up with. Here's our first round picks since 1998. Top ten guys bold faced. 1998 5 Curtis Enis HB Penn State 1999 12 Cade McNown QB UCLA 2000 9 Brian Urlacher LB/S New Mexico 2001 8 David Terrell WR Michigan 2002 29 Marc Colombo OT Boston College 2003 14 Michael Haynes DE Penn State [v] 2003 22 Rex Grossman QB Florida [v] 2004 14 Tommie Harris DT Oklahoma 2005 4 Cedric Benson HB Texas 2006 — No Pick — — [w] 2007 31 Greg Olsen TE Miami 2008 14 Chris Williams OT Vanderbilt 2009 — No Pick — — [x] 2010 — No Pick — — [x] 2011 29 Gabe Carimi OT Wisconsin 2012 19 Shea McClellin DE Boise State 2013 20 Kyle Long OT Oregon 2014 14 Kyle Fuller CB Virginia Tech 2015 7 Kevin White WR West Virginia 2016 9 Leonard Floyd
I get one and so far the last two are huge question marks. How many did you get?
Shee'ot Hoyer has looked better than Cutler imo . Not by much ... but better ( which ain't really sayin much ) .
Sure.....but how would Hoyer have looked if he'd played against Houston and Philly and their pass rush? You think Hoyer could have made those two long heaves to AJ that led to two TDs? LOL Not in this lifetime or the next. If not for those and a PR TD we may have been shut out or maybe kicked FG or two. For two games he and AJ were about the only offense we had.
Hoyer doesn't throw a very good long ball and like Rosenrant wrote most of his sideline throws looked like Jon Lester pick off throws to first. He threw a couple of them where even White couldn't reach them with an extension ladder. If Cutler has time to throw he's still a far better passer than Hoyer or Hoyer would already be starting.
Shee'ot Hoyer has looked better than Cutler imo . Not by much ... but better ( which ain't really sayin much ) .
Sure.....but how would Hoyer have looked if he'd played against Houston and Philly and their pass rush? You think Hoyer could have made those two long heaves to AJ that led to two TDs? LOL Not in this lifetime or the next. If not for those and a PR TD we may have been shut out or maybe kicked FG or two. For two games he and AJ were about the only offense we had.
Hoyer doesn't throw a very good long ball and like Rosenrant wrote most of his sideline throws looked like Jon Lester pick off throws to first. He threw a couple of them where even White couldn't reach them with an extension ladder. If Cutler has time to throw he's still a far better passer than Hoyer or Hoyer would already be starting.
Hoyer IS more decisive than Cutty though , gets rid of the ball quicker , spreads it around more ( not JUST looking for AJ like Cutty does ) . How is KW supposed to develop if Cutty NEVER throws him the f'n ball ?
Sure.....but how would Hoyer have looked if he'd played against Houston and Philly and their pass rush? You think Hoyer could have made those two long heaves to AJ that led to two TDs? LOL Not in this lifetime or the next. If not for those and a PR TD we may have been shut out or maybe kicked FG or two. For two games he and AJ were about the only offense we had.
Hoyer doesn't throw a very good long ball and like Rosenrant wrote most of his sideline throws looked like Jon Lester pick off throws to first. He threw a couple of them where even White couldn't reach them with an extension ladder. If Cutler has time to throw he's still a far better passer than Hoyer or Hoyer would already be starting.
Hoyer IS more decisive than Cutty though , gets rid of the ball quicker , spreads it around more ( not JUST looking for AJ like Cutty does ) . How is KW supposed to develop if Cutty NEVER throws him the f'n ball ?
Blue....that's one game and he had a lot of time to do it too. Dallas had no pressure on him all game long and he still couldn't win the game but Prescott did and he's a rookie! How good did Hoyer look most of the preseason? Before he was hurt Shaw was challenging him for the #2 spot and he was an UDFA we picked up on waivers.
Hoyer unloads quicker because he doesn't have Cutlers arm so he has to anticipate throws and he doesn't have the touch on longer throws that Cutler has so his ball isn't as catchable. They are two very different style passers but you still can't compare them by saying Hoyer looked better against zero pass rush and a soft cover-2 zone than Cutler looked against the blitzing and stunts Houston and Philly threw at him and man coverage. It's onions to bananas. Hoyer is a decent and experienced #2 guy. I'll give him that put he's till not better than Cutler and not off any comparison based on those three games.
Do you remember that winning TD pass he Cutler through to Forte against KC last year? He had a guy holding his ankle so he couldn't step into the throw at all yet he floated that ball into Forte right over tight coverage. That was touch and one of the nicest throws I've ever seen him make. I just wish he'd do it more often. Can you see Hoyer making that throw under pressure. He looked like crap in preseason whenever there was on rush on him. We all saw that and said shit, he's Jimmy Clausen v2.0.
Why doesn't Cutler throw to White more? Because AJ and Royal are more dependable WRs and there's less chance he'll be picked because KW ran the wrong route. He does do that. If you think he has some kind of breakout game the other night don't believe what you read and look at his stats.
Kevin White 6 62 10.3 32 0 14 0
That's 6 catches for 62 yards but he was targeted 14 times. How many did he drop? Three that I can recall for sure. How many did Hoyer throw so far OB Manute Bol or Yao Ming couldn't have caught them? KW made one kind of ridiculous reach around highlight 32 yard catch which shows what he can do but doesn't do nearly often enough. On the other 5 catches he gained 30 yards. Six yards per catch. RBs and TEs average more than that. Some of it's play calling. Some of it was on Hoyer. And some of it was on him but it was not a break out game by anyone's standards. AJ had 5 catches on 7 targets for 70 yds and average 14.0 ypc playing hurt. Maybe that's why Jay throws to him more. He's a far more efficient WR.
Hoyer IS more decisive than Cutty though , gets rid of the ball quicker , spreads it around more ( not JUST looking for AJ like Cutty does ) . How is KW supposed to develop if Cutty NEVER throws him the f'n ball ?
Blue....that's one game and he had a lot of time to do it too. Dallas had no pressure on him all game long and he still couldn't win the game but Prescott did and he's a rookie! How good did Hoyer look most of the preseason? Before he was hurt Shaw was challenging him for the #2 spot and he was an UDFA we picked up on waivers.
Hoyer unloads quicker because he doesn't have Cutlers arm so he has to anticipate throws and he doesn't have the touch on longer throws that Cutler has so his ball isn't as catchable. They are two very different style passers but you still can't compare them by saying Hoyer looked better against zero pass rush and a soft cover-2 zone than Cutler looked against the blitzing and stunts Houston and Philly threw at him and man coverage. It's onions to bananas. Hoyer is a decent and experienced #2 guy. I'll give him that put he's till not better than Cutler and not off any comparison based on those three games.
Do you remember that winning TD pass he Cutler through to Forte against KC last year? He had a guy holding his ankle so he couldn't step into the throw at all yet he floated that ball into Forte right over tight coverage. That was touch and one of the nicest throws I've ever seen him make. I just wish he'd do it more often. Can you see Hoyer making that throw under pressure. He looked like crap in preseason whenever there was on rush on him. We all saw that and said shit, he's Jimmy Clausen v2.0.
Why doesn't Cutler throw to White more? Because AJ and Royal are more dependable WRs and there's less chance he'll be picked because KW ran the wrong route. He does do that. If you think he has some kind of breakout game the other night don't believe what you read and look at his stats.
Kevin White 6 62 10.3 32 0 14 0
That's 6 catches for 62 yards but he was targeted 14 times. How many did he drop? Three that I can recall for sure. How many did Hoyer throw so far OB Manute Bol or Yao Ming couldn't have caught them? KW made one kind of ridiculous reach around highlight 32 yard catch which shows what he can do but doesn't do nearly often enough. On the other 5 catches he gained 30 yards. Six yards per catch. RBs and TEs average more than that. Some of it's play calling. Some of it was on Hoyer. And some of it was on him but it was not a break out game by anyone's standards. AJ had 5 catches on 7 targets for 70 yds and average 14.0 ypc playing hurt. Maybe that's why Jay throws to him more. He's a far more efficient WR.
One of the reasons Cutty gets sacked too much and fumbles too much is he's holding the ball too long waiting for AJ to get open , and he did the same thing when BMarsh was here . I've been replaying ( in slo-mo ) for years now and there were multiple times when other guys were open ( on plays where Cutty made turnovers )cuz he was glued to 1 guy and waited too long to get the ball out . THAT'S Cuttys biggest problem and it's the reason he's never been as good a QB as he could have become , and it's the reason most of us are tired of him and his TO's and have reached the end of our rope and want him to go .
I'll give you he trows the long ball better - but how often are bombs used in games ? 2 , 3 times ? and how often is it even effective ? and when it is , does it make up for the rest of the game when the O was limping along ?
Yep Hoyer is mostly a dink & dunk QB , and dink dunk offenses drive me crazy cuz ur always falling short on 3rd down .... so the solution is find a guy who can make the 10-15 yd throws and keep the friggin chains moving - and he ain't on our roster rt now ... so we gotta go get one .
OK have it your way. All I know is Hoyer came here as the #2 and not to compete for the #1 spot. Jesus Christ could tell me to start Hoyer and I would debate that with him too.
Whatever he decides to do with Cutler after this year is up to him (if Fox is still here) but if he's healthy he starts now unless like Fox has done with other position and starts the 2nd or 3rd best option he has.
That's why I think he's becoming a crazy old coot with a few screws loose and doesn't really have a plan or know what he wants to accomplish long term which simply mean he won't. If you fail to plan then you must plan to fail. You set measurable objectives and you measure yourself or are allowed to be measure by that. Every successful operation I have ever run or been a part of works that way. Every single one.
Fox has failed to meet his objectives of game by game improvement and he's avoiding setting new ones because he no longer wants to be measured by any but those he accepts as being OK. Elway expected another SB run in 2014. Fox was one and done in the playoffs and actually asked why just winning their division wasn't good enough for Elway if it was good enough for Fox. (rolleyes here)
Cutler isn't the problem because no NFL QB presently alive, or dead, could have done much better in the mess we've been creating for 5 years or so now. We're approaching Cleveland Browns type futility.
OK have it your way. All I know is Hoyer came here as the #2 and not to compete for the #1 spot. Jesus Christ could tell me to start Hoyer and I would debate that with him too.
Whatever he decides to do with Cutler after this year is up to him (if Fox is still here) but if he's healthy he starts now unless like Fox has done with other position and starts the 2nd or 3rd best option he has.
That's why I think he's becoming a crazy old coot with a few screws loose and doesn't really have a plan or know what he wants to accomplish long term which simply mean he won't. If you fail to plan then you must plan to fail. You set measurable objectives and you measure yourself or are allowed to be measure by that. Every successful operation I have ever run or been a part of works that way. Every single one.
Fox has failed to meet his objectives of game by game improvement and he's avoiding setting new ones because he no longer wants to be measured by any but those he accepts as being OK. Elway expected another SB run in 2014. Fox was one and done in the playoffs and actually asked why just winning their division wasn't good enough for Elway if it was good enough for Fox. (rolleyes here)
Cutler isn't the problem because no NFL QB presently alive, or dead, could have done much better in the mess we've been creating for 5 years or so now. We're approaching Cleveland Browns type futility.
I agree with you Cutty has never been the whole problem , but he's definitely been a part of it .
I also agree with you that Foxy needs a heart transplant if he thinks winning the division should be ' good enough ' , and that he seems to be floundering this one time things haven't gone his way .
