I realize this is pre-draft and pre-FA, and Pace is a work in progress. Still, I am curious where everyone sees Pace at this point. After 2 years, is your opinion of Pace trending up or down at this point?
Right now it's flat, he's done some good draft things and some good FA things; but his inability to solve the QB position is a YUGE knock against him. If he gets that corrected it will go up, if he pushes it off for another year it'll go WAY down
Yeah...right not it's about even. I like some things he's done...and I don't like some things he's done. I'm not going to give him a grade for this off season until it's done. I obviously don't like the start of it, not tagging Alshon and letting him test FA...but we'll see how he finishes up. If he signs 1 or 2 legit corners and a safety and replaces Alshon with a decent talent, and improves the TE position..I'll have a better taste in my mouth
How can anyone have an honest opinion of his work when you feel it's being driven from above by what he's being permitted to do? No sane NFL GM would NOT have fired John Fox after last season. But that would have created yet another embarrassment for Teddy Bears and GMcC. No one will ever get me to believe that Fox's hire was not a requirement in the package that got Pace his GM job.
For every step Pace has attempted to make forward John Fox's piss poor roster management has set him back. The game he played with his QBs last fall not backing Cutler as his starter once he returned from injury not only severed all ties between them but it's also made it nearly impossible for Pace to trade Cutler for fair value. The entire NFL knows that marriage is over so why pay in pick and assume an existing contract if you can sign him as a UFA? A QB like Sam Bradford brought a 1st and a 4th and Cutler isn't even worth a mid round pick? What crap. I've never seen anything so poorly handled in my life.
So in other words Fox has not only manipulated his way into getting a new QB but also damaged the value of a team asset. Stack this on top of some of his other decisions all while trying to instill a new "culture" that loses far more often than it wins and ask yourself how this guy has still kept his job. It looks to me like he's Paces worst nightmare yet Phillips and GMcC have stuck him with him. These two are almost as bad as Mikey was.
I'll say it again. There is no way to fairly evaluate Pace now and more than likely there will not be while John Fox is still HC and Ted Phillips and GMcC are still running this team. In four years they have gone from a middle of the pack team to one of the very worst run teams in the entire NFL and anyone who denies that must be either be blind or the most optimistic SOB on the planet.
Right now it's flat, he's done some good draft things and some good FA things; but his inability to solve the QB position is a YUGE knock against him. If he gets that corrected it will go up, if he pushes it off for another year it'll go WAY down
How can anyone have an honest opinion of his work when you feel it's being driven from above by what he's being permitted to do? No sane NFL GM would NOT have fired John Fox after last season. But that would have created yet another embarrassment for Teddy Bears and GMcC. No one will ever get me to believe that Fox's hire was not a requirement in the package that got Pace his GM job.
For every step Pace has attempted to make forward John Fox's piss poor roster management has set him back. The game he played with his QBs last fall not backing Cutler as his starter once he returned from injury not only severed all ties between them but it's also made it nearly impossible for Pace to trade Cutler for fair value. The entire NFL knows that marriage is over so why pay in pick and assume an existing contract if you can sign him as a UFA? A QB like Sam Bradford brought a 1st and a 4th and Cutler isn't even worth a mid round pick? What crap. I've never seen anything so poorly handled in my life.
So in other words Fox has not only manipulated his way into getting a new QB but also damaged the value of a team asset. Stack this on top of some of his other decisions all while trying to instill a new "culture" that loses far more often than it wins and ask yourself how this guy has still kept his job. It looks to me like he's Paces worst nightmare yet Phillips and GMcC have stuck him with him. These two are almost as bad as Mikey was.
I'll say it again. There is no way to fairly evaluate Pace now and more than likely there will not be while John Fox is still HC and Ted Phillips and GMcC are still running this team. In four years they have gone from a middle of the pack team to one of the very worst run teams in the entire NFL and anyone who denies that must be either be blind or the most optimistic SOB on the planet.
You make some good points, Soul. But here's where I am at. Whether Pace is making the GM decisions - or - if he is allowing himself to be manipulated by others (above him, like George M. or Ted Phillips - or beneath him, in John Fox), that is still Pace's choice. Either he is choosing to make the moves we see, or he is choosing to be a puppet - that is on Pace. Good or bad. That is on Pace. It is his choice. If he is just allowing himself to be a puppet to collect a paycheck, then I would have even LESS of an opinion of him.
How can anyone have an honest opinion of his work when you feel it's being driven from above by what he's being permitted to do? No sane NFL GM would NOT have fired John Fox after last season. But that would have created yet another embarrassment for Teddy Bears and GMcC. No one will ever get me to believe that Fox's hire was not a requirement in the package that got Pace his GM job.
For every step Pace has attempted to make forward John Fox's piss poor roster management has set him back. The game he played with his QBs last fall not backing Cutler as his starter once he returned from injury not only severed all ties between them but it's also made it nearly impossible for Pace to trade Cutler for fair value. The entire NFL knows that marriage is over so why pay in pick and assume an existing contract if you can sign him as a UFA? A QB like Sam Bradford brought a 1st and a 4th and Cutler isn't even worth a mid round pick? What crap. I've never seen anything so poorly handled in my life.
So in other words Fox has not only manipulated his way into getting a new QB but also damaged the value of a team asset. Stack this on top of some of his other decisions all while trying to instill a new "culture" that loses far more often than it wins and ask yourself how this guy has still kept his job. It looks to me like he's Paces worst nightmare yet Phillips and GMcC have stuck him with him. These two are almost as bad as Mikey was.
I'll say it again. There is no way to fairly evaluate Pace now and more than likely there will not be while John Fox is still HC and Ted Phillips and GMcC are still running this team. In four years they have gone from a middle of the pack team to one of the very worst run teams in the entire NFL and anyone who denies that must be either be blind or the most optimistic SOB on the planet.
You make some good points, Soul. But here's where I am at. Whether Pace is making the GM decisions - or - if he is allowing himself to be manipulated by others (above him, like George M. or Ted Phillips - or beneath him, in John Fox), that is still Pace's choice. Either he is choosing to make the moves we see, or he is choosing to be a puppet - that is on Pace. Good or bad. That is on Pace. It is his choice. If he is just allowing himself to be a puppet to collect a paycheck, then I would have even LESS of an opinion of him.
All I'm saying is don't dismiss the possibility that it is just that way and that John Fox wields far more power over personnel decisions than many believe. Pace was offered a very good job with a legacy NFL franchise. One he was unlikely to turn down even as a few caveats may have been added by those who would claim to be far more experienced as managers of an NFL team. The only problem there is experience is not the equivalent of skill, talent, or intellect when it comes to doing it.
There can be no doubt among Bears fans that the firing of Jerry Angelo was largely based on his failure to draft well. So Teddy Bears and GMcC hired a former Bears scout and personnel guy in the belief that it would not only improve talent but also reduce the costs of having to pursue and sign top level UFAs to huge guaranteed contracts. That was the plan correct? But it failed. Emery's drafts were no better than JA's and possibly worse and his choice for HC turned into a fiasco.
The hiring of Ryan Pace was simply another swing at the same pitch. He was a young well respected personnel guy but not their first choice. That was Eric DeCosta who refused to even interview with them. So in comes Pace ostensibly to run the draft but he does not run the team. That privilege is still granted to Teddy Bears and GMcC who preferred a veteran HC from a winning organization so that it would be an easy sale to Pace and fans alike. While they expected John Fox to be somewhat low key and non-controversial he's actually been anything but and his finger prints are all over a number of key roster decisions. Mostly very bad one.
So how can I tell you what I think of Ryan Pace as a GM when in reality he's not much more than the same personnel guy he was in NOLA. He's more like their chief scout and draft guru because unlike many other NFL GMs he doesn't run football operation with total autonomy. Given that I have no choice but to handicap my rating of him based only on what's he's allowed to do and whether you or any other Bears fan chooses to believe it as long as Ted Phillips is the CEO that will be limited to what Phillips and the McCaskeys' will OK.
So tell me this. What's changed? This team is still being run top down by the seat of their pants by some of the most inept managers and owners in the entire NFL. By now conventional wisdom would say either sell the God damn team to someone who does have the skills to manage it correctly or hire a top NFL Exec to run it but they refuse to do either or remove Ted Phillips as CEO so that barrier to actually hiring top exec talent no longer exists.
Pace is merely protecting his paycheck the same way most of us would do as well. He's not the problem. I've outlined the true problem many times and have done so here again. When I ask the question what's changed and you can honestly tell me that someone other then Phillips and GMcC are the ones who are really calling the shots then there may be some cause for optimism. Until then I see none.
For me it's flat. I still like what he's done for the most part but the Jeffery deal has me sour. It will all depend on how FA and the draft go.
FA and the draft will be Yuge for Pace this year. He has to find the qb of the future, eithe via FA/trade or the draft; and it sounds less and less like FA/trade is going to be a viable option.
And now he's going to have to find help there also, a more reliable TE and WR.