One point we have to remember especially for the BMarsh situation is that Pace, Fox & co arrived to a complete trainwreck of an organization had had to install a new culture, attitude, whatever you want to call it ASAP.
Regardless of what you think about a player's day off and his right to do what he wants or not (and I value my personal time off work very highly), BMarsh put a bulls-eye on himself by doing that. Sometimes you have to play the game if you want to remain in an organization. And BMarsh may be many things but he is not stupid. So I assume he was ready to leave if it came to that and basically didn't care.
Post by butkus3595 on Sept 1, 2016 17:40:30 GMT -6
I never thought it was a huge deal and I still don't. There are guys who do much worse in their off time than get on a private jet to fly and do a show that will help them advance themselves in a career once they're done playing football. I kind of get where Pace and Fox are coming from, but I'll tell you what...my boss doesn't tell me what to do on my off days...do yours? Further, Marshall didn't have to ask permission or inform them of his plans either...he did it as a courtesy...again...it was on HIS off day.
But it's all water under the bridge now...we traded a great player for a 5th round pick cause he wanted to do a show on his off day...YAY!
I can see both sides here. Its the official off day and unless the contract says he can't do it, he's free to do what he wants. On the other hand, coming in to Halas Hall and tutoring Jeffery or the other WRs, working with Jay on a route tree would also be a team effective activity. Flying first class isn't as stressful as flying coach. I don't think that was the issue. I think it was a player daring to not have football 100% on his mind 100% of the time.
What I wonder about is if players who have interests outside/past football will now look at Fox/Pace and say to themselves, not Chicago I'll find a more player friendly organization.
If this decision by Pace/Fox causes us to miss out on football players who have other interest more important to them than the team, then I am ok with it.
I never thought it was a huge deal and I still don't. There are guys who do much worse in their off time than get on a private jet to fly and do a show that will help them advance themselves in a career once they're done playing football. I kind of get where Pace and Fox are coming from, but I'll tell you what...my boss doesn't tell me what to do on my off days...do yours? Further, Marshall didn't have to ask permission or inform them of his plans either...he did it as a courtesy...again...it was on HIS off day.
But it's all water under the bridge now...we traded a great player for a 5th round pick cause he wanted to do a show on his off day...YAY!
I think there was more to it from the Bears perspective than just the TV thing. Money played it's part but BM wasn't gonna bring that up. We can't forget that Emery had left Pace saddled with Marshall's $30 mil contract extension and the need to negotiate a new deal for AJ was coming up. With both Cooper and White entering the draft I think Pace also felt confident he could draft one of them and he would be the replacement for BM but for far less money.
I do believe that Marshall's reluctance to give up his TV spot sealed the deal and gave them an excuse to move him that wasn't only money motivated but I don't think we can say money was never part of the reason at all. It had to be especially with Pace digging for cap dollars to use in rebuilding the defense and in that regard BM was the trade off for McPhee and it looks like we did OK with that 5th round pick getting a young starting Safety out of it.
If you look at it from that perspective that really what we gained in exchange for BM.
It's hard to say what broke the camels back, but I think pretty much everyone agreed that BM was a true #1 WR and a difference maker.
The fact that they let him go for almost nothing tells me that they were making a statement and taking a stand. I'm sure that the TV thing played a big part. Perhaps that little public Cutler tantrum also. but I don't think money was the issue, so we can safely assume that they wanted him out. It certainly was not his performance. So what is left is the "intangibles" --- public forum, perceived not to be all in when he had a tv show going on, maybe a rift with Cutler (locker room issues). Whatever they were, however many there were and how they weighed in, I have no idea, but they were there. It is the only reason you get rid of a guy like that.
Was it the right choice? Honestly, I can't say. I don;t know the private dynamic between him and Jay or the other players and if was perceived to be beyond repair. I do know (for sure now that he came out with it) that his not being able to do the show was not acceptable to him and his doing the show was not acceptable to the Bears --- maybe that was the one and only reason.... maybe not.... but it was a reason.
My personal take on this is when you are being paid that kind of money, the people that are paying it have a right to ask that career wise you make this your one and only focus. Most players want to have something to slide into after their career. I know I would, but most players also wait until their career is over before working actively on it. I don;t see why Marshall could not have played out his career and then become an announcer, so I don;t agree with his position that he had to do it during the season as an active player, but that's me.
You don't think the $30 mil/3 yr extension Emery gave him played into it at all? I'll never believe that and I also believe that's why it was tougher to get more than a 5th round pick for him because whoever did trade for him would assume that contract. In fact the Jets actually restructured it a year later to work it into their 2015 cap.
I'm not saying it was the only reason, or even the primary reason, but to say it played no part in it at all isn't looking at all of the reasons either. By trading BM and drafting KW the Bears have gained roughly $13 mil in additional cap space in 2015 and 2016 and they'll gain another $5.5 mil in 2017. That's an $18.5 mil difference at a time when that money was badly needed to rebuild the defense and a two top college WRs were available to draft.
We can argue that it hasn't exactly worked out like it was planned due to KW's injury and BM's Pro Bowl 2015 season in comparison but the money did factor in. I have no doubts about that at all.
I never thought it was a huge deal and I still don't. There are guys who do much worse in their off time than get on a private jet to fly and do a show that will help them advance themselves in a career once they're done playing football. I kind of get where Pace and Fox are coming from, but I'll tell you what...my boss doesn't tell me what to do on my off days...do yours? Further, Marshall didn't have to ask permission or inform them of his plans either...he did it as a courtesy...again...it was on HIS off day.
But it's all water under the bridge now...we traded a great player for a 5th round pick cause he wanted to do a show on his off day...YAY!
I think there was more to it from the Bears perspective than just the TV thing. Money played it's part but BM wasn't gonna bring that up. We can't forget that Emery had left Pace saddled with Marshall's $30 mil contract extension and the need to negotiate a new deal for AJ was coming up. With both Cooper and White entering the draft I think Pace also felt confident he could draft one of them and he would be the replacement for BM but for far less money.
I do believe that Marshall's reluctance to give up his TV spot sealed the deal and gave them an excuse to move him that wasn't only money motivated but I don't think we can say money was never part of the reason at all. It had to be especially with Pace digging for cap dollars to use in rebuilding the defense and in that regard BM was the trade off for McPhee and it looks like we did OK with that 5th round pick getting a young starting Safety out of it.
If you look at it from that perspective that really what we gained in exchange for BM.
Yeah...I always thought the money played a role too...but if you look at the production he's put up vs what he's being paid...even that isn't a bad deal if you ask me.
It's hard to say what broke the camels back, but I think pretty much everyone agreed that BM was a true #1 WR and a difference maker.
The fact that they let him go for almost nothing tells me that they were making a statement and taking a stand. I'm sure that the TV thing played a big part. Perhaps that little public Cutler tantrum also. but I don't think money was the issue, so we can safely assume that they wanted him out. It certainly was not his performance. So what is left is the "intangibles" --- public forum, perceived not to be all in when he had a tv show going on, maybe a rift with Cutler (locker room issues). Whatever they were, however many there were and how they weighed in, I have no idea, but they were there. It is the only reason you get rid of a guy like that.
Was it the right choice? Honestly, I can't say. I don;t know the private dynamic between him and Jay or the other players and if was perceived to be beyond repair. I do know (for sure now that he came out with it) that his not being able to do the show was not acceptable to him and his doing the show was not acceptable to the Bears --- maybe that was the one and only reason.... maybe not.... but it was a reason.
My personal take on this is when you are being paid that kind of money, the people that are paying it have a right to ask that career wise you make this your one and only focus. Most players want to have something to slide into after their career. I know I would, but most players also wait until their career is over before working actively on it. I don;t see why Marshall could not have played out his career and then become an announcer, so I don;t agree with his position that he had to do it during the season as an active player, but that's me.
That's really not true. Most players have other businesses that they start up while they are playing football. To quote Chris Canty who played for the Giants and Ravens, you have to take advantage of your name while you're still playing, because once your done they've forgotten about you. Now thats not necessarily totally true either, but Marshall has a name right now and to not take advantage of it would be selling himself and his future earning ability short. He's proven it hasn't prevented him from putting up #1 receiver numbers...and at the end of the day thats all that matters. The Bears don't care about Brandon Marshall or any other players future...it's up to the player to take care of that, and in the case of Brandon Marshall he knew if the Bears weren't ok with him doing the show his talents would ensure there was some team out there that would.
I think there was more to it from the Bears perspective than just the TV thing. Money played it's part but BM wasn't gonna bring that up. We can't forget that Emery had left Pace saddled with Marshall's $30 mil contract extension and the need to negotiate a new deal for AJ was coming up. With both Cooper and White entering the draft I think Pace also felt confident he could draft one of them and he would be the replacement for BM but for far less money.
I do believe that Marshall's reluctance to give up his TV spot sealed the deal and gave them an excuse to move him that wasn't only money motivated but I don't think we can say money was never part of the reason at all. It had to be especially with Pace digging for cap dollars to use in rebuilding the defense and in that regard BM was the trade off for McPhee and it looks like we did OK with that 5th round pick getting a young starting Safety out of it.
If you look at it from that perspective that really what we gained in exchange for BM.
Yeah...I always thought the money played a role too...but if you look at the production he's put up vs what he's being paid...even that isn't a bad deal if you ask me.
Yeah, I agree. Overall BM just seemed to give them one too many excuses to move on from him just as Marty Bennett did. I don't see John Fox as a fool or the type of HC who can't adjust to a few guys who have a bit of a prima dona complex but his refusal to drop the TV was probably the last straw for them. They wanted out and they found a buyer.
I was never happy with the trade either especially not for so little but at least Pace has manged to parlay it into a win/win deal provided Amos keeps improving and McPhee isn't lost for good after just one season. That one has me worried. I'm seeing a deju vu of the Tommie Harris issue.