Why have the Bears been so bad at developing quarterbacks?

JABF
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Why have the Bears been so bad at developing quarterbacks? May 21, 2024 11:28:43 GMT -6 riczaj01 likes this

Post by JABF on May 21, 2024 11:28:43 GMT -6

From Courtney Cronin... it's something riczaj01 has touched on before over the years here on our messageboard - turnover is a killer to a franchise in general. Courtney is saying it is especially lethal to developing a QB1.

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Why have the Bears been so bad at developing quarterbacks?

“It’s multifaceted. First and foremost, the turnover they’ve had with coaching regimes. It’s nine offensive coordinators and five head coaches. The turnover there is detrimental to the growth of young quarterbacks. When I had a conversation with (general manager) Ryan Poles, there are layers to this. He has strategically tried to put this team in a position where you’re bringing in a rookie quarterback with a new offensive coordinator so those two are on the same playing field. Justin Fields never had a chance because he went from the coaching staff that drafted him to a coaching staff that inherited him. He has to learn another offense in a two-year stretch.”

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riczaj01
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Why have the Bears been so bad at developing quarterbacks? May 21, 2024 11:35:44 GMT -6 AlexM and bears40 like this

Post by riczaj01 on May 21, 2024 11:35:44 GMT -6

it's detrimental to the entire team. GM/HC turnover means regardless of previous drafts hits/misses, you have even more turnover. All teams, O and D require stability, all players to develop, require stability. It's only the truly rare ones that will prosper regardless. And most teams won't have more than a few of those.

It's one thing to have a short lease on vet hc's, but the Bears rarely hire those, it's almost always young inexperienced coaches, same w/GM. Then for some reason expect them to change their trash franchise that they have f'd up for 40 years around in 3-4; and again this goes back to players and the QB.

Regardless of what you think of Flus and his staff/team, if the Bears are serious about fixing the team and the qb position, they cannot be on the hotseat and fired next year, unless it's a Nagy like meltdown in Nagy's final year. But I doubt that happens.

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brasilbear
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Why have the Bears been so bad at developing quarterbacks? May 21, 2024 14:47:47 GMT -6 shark86 and papabear7 like this

Post by brasilbear on May 21, 2024 14:47:47 GMT -6

and I'll say this, not in defense of the staffs the Bears ran out of town, but to point out the obvious: simply retaining staff because running though HC and OC is bad is also not a viable way to team build.

brasilbear retells the sad sad recent history here in Chicago:

SPOILER: Click to show

Lovie: IMO the team had stagnated on both OFF and DEF. No OC worth his salt was going to come and work in Chicago. Cutler was an OC killer. The DEF was good to very good, but...despite what many were peaching at the time, that wasn't going to be good enough to win playoff games.

Verdict: Lovie had to go.

Trestman: The mistake was not in firing Lovie, it was turning to Trestman. Trestman may have wanted to coach a team of grown a$$ men, but he ended up coaching a team of cry babies. He is 100% not absolved, he owns the disaster.

Verdict: Trestman had to go, even if it was only two years he wasn't turning it around.

Fox: Biggest mistake at HC in my lifetime. I'll fight you over this. Completely worthless as a coach, IMO he was here simply to collect a paycheck. The McCaskey's were hoodwinked into hiring him. They didn't need Fox to "change the culture." Simply getting rid of the malcontents would have done it. This is when the pattern of GM/HC/QB got out of whack. But, would keeping Fox with Pace and Mitch really have been the solution instead of moving on from Fox? Did we really think Fox and Loggains were going to generate anything resembling a modern OFF?

Verdict: Fox should have been fired after the Seahawks debacle week three of his first year here. Seriously, they would have been better off firing Fox at that point and giving the team to Gase.

Nagy: Completely in over his head. Couldn't game plan, couldn't call plays either strategically or tactically, couldn't develop 2 first round QBs...

Verdict: Nagy had to go.

So tell me, which HC/OC/QB combo should the Bears have kept? All the firings made sense in context at the time.

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Last Edit: May 21, 2024 14:48:42 GMT -6 by brasilbear

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Why have the Bears been so bad at developing quarterbacks? May 21, 2024 20:22:51 GMT -6 riczaj01 and dachuckster like this

Post by JABF on May 21, 2024 20:22:51 GMT -6

May 21, 2024 11:35:44 GMT -6 riczaj01 said:

it's detrimental to the entire team. GM/HC turnover means regardless of previous drafts hits/misses, you have even more turnover. All teams, O and D require stability, all players to develop, require stability. It's only the truly rare ones that will prosper regardless. And most teams won't have more than a few of those.

It's one thing to have a short lease on vet hc's, but the Bears rarely hire those, it's almost always young inexperienced coaches, same w/GM. Then for some reason expect them to change their trash franchise that they have f'd up for 40 years around in 3-4; and again this goes back to players and the QB.

Regardless of what you think of Flus and his staff/team, if the Bears are serious about fixing the team and the qb position, they cannot be on the hotseat and fired next year, unless it's a Nagy like meltdown in Nagy's final year. But I doubt that happens.

This ^^^^^
The Bears chose to go with a rookie GM in Poles and a rookie HC in Eberflus. There is a learning curve associated with that choice and it's a rough ride for fans. Fans want instant gratification and they want everyone fired early and often. It wasn't but a half season ago that a significant percentage of Chicago Bears fans wanted Poles fired. You can't win that way... at some point you have to see if these guys can climb the learning curve and pan out as winners. JMO.

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Why have the Bears been so bad at developing quarterbacks? May 21, 2024 20:30:05 GMT -6

Post by JABF on May 21, 2024 20:30:05 GMT -6

May 21, 2024 14:47:47 GMT -6 brasilbear said:

So tell me, which HC/OC/QB combo should the Bears have kept? All the firings made sense in context at the time.

No, I get it. There were multiple bad hires here. So we had a toxic franchise that failed year after year after year. But (for me) I am now trying to be forward focused and I just figure we can't change the past. It's past. But the team can give Poles/Eberflus an opportunity now to prove they can build a winner here. One thing I know. Constant turnover will never (ever) end up with the Bears being a great franchise. I want to see this GM/HC show what they can, and can't do here before we do the "cycle of fail" again. I think the franchise is looking promising right now with Warren/Poles/Cunningham/Eberflus - and I also like the OC/DC we have going into this season.

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Last Edit: May 21, 2024 20:31:38 GMT -6 by JABF

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shark86
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Why have the Bears been so bad at developing quarterbacks? May 21, 2024 20:31:21 GMT -6

Post by shark86 on May 21, 2024 20:31:21 GMT -6

May 21, 2024 20:22:51 GMT -6 JABF said:

May 21, 2024 11:35:44 GMT -6 riczaj01 said:

it's detrimental to the entire team. GM/HC turnover means regardless of previous drafts hits/misses, you have even more turnover. All teams, O and D require stability, all players to develop, require stability. It's only the truly rare ones that will prosper regardless. And most teams won't have more than a few of those.

It's one thing to have a short lease on vet hc's, but the Bears rarely hire those, it's almost always young inexperienced coaches, same w/GM. Then for some reason expect them to change their trash franchise that they have f'd up for 40 years around in 3-4; and again this goes back to players and the QB.

Regardless of what you think of Flus and his staff/team, if the Bears are serious about fixing the team and the qb position, they cannot be on the hotseat and fired next year, unless it's a Nagy like meltdown in Nagy's final year. But I doubt that happens.

This ^^^^^
The Bears chose to go with a rookie GM in Poles and a rookie HC in Eberflus. There is a learning curve associated with that choice and it's a rough ride for fans. Fans want instant gratification and they want everyone fired early and often. It wasn't but a half season ago that a significant percentage of Chicago Bears fans wanted Poles fired. You can't win that way... at some point you have to see if these guys can climb the learning curve and pan out as winners. JMO.

It was "intuitively obvious to the most casual observer" that neither Fox, Trestman nor Nagy were the long-term answer at HC. The same for Emery, although Pace maybe might possibly have gotten a little better with education and experience, but I doubt it. It was right to move on from all of them, Including Lovie. The problem was who we moved on to. Every single time.

Problem with people wanting Poles fired early was repeated shellshock. We got used to pathetic and wanted to move on again before it got "that" bad again.

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Last Edit: May 21, 2024 20:33:02 GMT -6 by shark86

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bearsinhouston
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Why have the Bears been so bad at developing quarterbacks? May 21, 2024 20:40:25 GMT -6 bears40 likes this

Post by bearsinhouston on May 21, 2024 20:40:25 GMT -6

May 21, 2024 20:31:21 GMT -6 shark86 said:

May 21, 2024 20:22:51 GMT -6 JABF said:

This ^^^^^
The Bears chose to go with a rookie GM in Poles and a rookie HC in Eberflus. There is a learning curve associated with that choice and it's a rough ride for fans. Fans want instant gratification and they want everyone fired early and often. It wasn't but a half season ago that a significant percentage of Chicago Bears fans wanted Poles fired. You can't win that way... at some point you have to see if these guys can climb the learning curve and pan out as winners. JMO.

It was "intuitively obvious to the most casual observer" that neither Fox, Trestman nor Nagy were the long-term answer at HC. The same for Emery, although Pace maybe might possibly have gotten a little better with education and experience, but I doubt it. It was right to move on from all of them, Including Lovie. The problem was who we moved on to. Every single time.

Problem with people wanting Poles fired early was repeated shellshock. We got used to pathetic and wanted to move on again before it got "that" bad again.

The issue with that is that you usually only truly recognize how bad they are after the fact. During their stay, you know they are not cutting it, but you hope they can turn it around. That is what makes the timing difficult. Lovie was not bad, IMO. But he stagnated. He could not seem to make the team any better. Not only his fault as a HC. The GM of course was a big part. So when do you cut bait. If our present HC does better but then sits at that plateau, when is the time up? Not a cut and dry answer. But I will say that Flus is not immune to being let go. It all depends on how he does. What results he gets with what he has. Do I expect him to be let go this year? No.

But you can never take it off the table

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paytonisgod
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Why have the Bears been so bad at developing quarterbacks? May 21, 2024 20:46:43 GMT -6 brasilbear likes this

Post by paytonisgod on May 21, 2024 20:46:43 GMT -6

How about because we just drafted bad QBs? Not that our coaching has been anything to write home about, but I think it's mostly been just bad selections. None of our former QBs went onto anything significant after they left. Nor has the team been good about surrounding them with a lot of talent consistently. Most QBs fail as starters in this league.

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bearsinhouston
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Why have the Bears been so bad at developing quarterbacks? May 21, 2024 20:54:49 GMT -6 riczaj01 and JABF like this

Post by bearsinhouston on May 21, 2024 20:54:49 GMT -6

May 21, 2024 20:46:43 GMT -6 paytonisgod said:

How about because we just drafted bad QBs? Not that our coaching has been anything to write home about, but I think it's mostly been just bad selections. None of our former QBs went onto anything significant after they left. Nor has the team been good about surrounding them with a lot of talent consistently. Most QBs fail as starters in this league.

That's kind of like saying that after the fruit was spoiled when we had it, no one that tasted it afterwards thought it tasted good either.

I really believe that like the article said, it is multifaceted. The QBs might not have been the best, but a few of them I think could have been successful elsewhere. I do think the Bears had a part in QB failures. Not to say all the QBs we picked were good. We had some spectacularly bad QB picks, but I don't think it is that easy

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Why have the Bears been so bad at developing quarterbacks?

Post by JABF on May 21, 2024 11:28:43 GMT -6

Post by riczaj01 on May 21, 2024 11:35:44 GMT -6

Post by brasilbear on May 21, 2024 14:47:47 GMT -6

Post by JABF on May 21, 2024 20:22:51 GMT -6

Post by JABF on May 21, 2024 20:30:05 GMT -6

Post by shark86 on May 21, 2024 20:31:21 GMT -6

Post by bearsinhouston on May 21, 2024 20:40:25 GMT -6

Post by paytonisgod on May 21, 2024 20:46:43 GMT -6

Post by bearsinhouston on May 21, 2024 20:54:49 GMT -6