Looking back...

motm
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Looking back... Dec 15, 2016 16:17:40 GMT -6

Post by motm on Dec 15, 2016 16:17:40 GMT -6

Dec 15, 2016 16:11:33 GMT -6 hawkeye21 said:

Dec 15, 2016 16:00:29 GMT -6 motm said:

Would this be a losing season?

NFC North isn't a powerhouse division this year. Heck we should be 2-0 against the NFC North leader. If we had WRs who could catch the ball we could be 6-7 or higher... Heck the Packers are 7-6 and have a hurt Aaron Rodgers. This is the time we can possibly beat them.

What's Brandon Marshall replacement doing for our future? Oh wait we still don't know cause he can't stay healthy...

If this team had Forte, Marshall, and Slauson we would be better off this season.

You didn't really answer anything. So they could have 7 wins instead of 3. What does that do but finish another losing season and those guys all become another year older. What are they doing to help build this team? The team was bad with them before and they would still be bad with them this year. Right now Forte has a miniscus tear and will be having surgery when the season is over.

It would be different if the Bears were really close to winning it all and just needed a couple key guys. Guys that you pay to be here for a year or two even though they are older.

So being 7-6 right now being a losing season? I would of much prefer that over what we have now. We have meaningless games until the season is over. Being in the race for playoffs is something I crave for this team to have again.

Who knows if Forte would of got hurt when playing here. Can't use that as an excuse with the Jets. I would believe Forte's purpose would be for the passing game and Howard would be for our Run game.

This season would be much different if we had Marshall, Forte, and Slauson here.

I'll answer both questions again:

"So if Marshall was here the season would be so much better?"

Yes, his replacement is an injury prone player...

"Or are you just looking for a couple more wins in a losing season?"

It wouldn't be a losing season if we were competing which I believe we would be.

Sure I want the bears to tank now. Only because there is no purpose for a win.

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hawkeye21
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Looking back... Dec 15, 2016 16:26:10 GMT -6 MartianBearsFan likes this

Post by hawkeye21 on Dec 15, 2016 16:26:10 GMT -6

Would the Bears have done anything even if they were competitive other then give us some entertainment? Most likely it would have been a losing season of 7 totals wins at the most. Forte's injury does matter because they are telling signs of an aging RB.

The goal for Pace is to build a solid team that can contend for the SB. Keeping older players from the past regime does not always help, especially when the rest of the team is so weak. Those older players take up cap space and roster space. The Bears may have a luxury with cap space but they do not with roster space. You can only have 53 players and that makes it hard to develop a younger team when you're keeping the older players. Once those older players are done then what do you have left? I think Pace decided to start with a clean slate and start his team from scratch as best he could.

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JABF
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Looking back... Dec 15, 2016 16:28:57 GMT -6 MartianBearsFan and hawkeye21 like this

Post by JABF on Dec 15, 2016 16:28:57 GMT -6

Dec 15, 2016 16:11:33 GMT -6 hawkeye21 said:

It would be different if the Bears were really close to winning it all and just needed a couple key guys. Guys that you pay to be here for a year or two even though they are older.

+1
I like the idea of starting over with a young team on the way up. That is not meant to discredit the people we let go. The downside is that we have a team of young/new people everywhere. Short term it sucks. Long term, it may pay off with a team that can sustain winning over a number of years. At least I hope so.

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brasilbear
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Looking back... Dec 15, 2016 16:29:38 GMT -6 JABF likes this

Post by brasilbear on Dec 15, 2016 16:29:38 GMT -6

Lots of good points here. I tend to took at it as an action-consequence (or cause-effect) relationship.

1. Marshall--trading Marshall opens a hole in the WR core that results in the Bears drafting White. As of right now, that doesn't look like a good result.

2. Forte--Forte was let go because the Bears wanted to use Langford and Carey as the RBbC. When Langford/Carey didn't work out (lack of production and injuries) Howard picked up the slack. The debate is if letting go Forte because of Langford and Carey was a good idea. I'd say...no, but it has worked out. Kind of like a backdoor cover in gambling.

3. Bennett--early in the season when Miller was not hurt, it was a wash. Brown has picked up the slack so far, no idea on how next year will look.

4. Slausen--Pace totally got lucky that Sitton was cut (although I loved when motm earlier tried to imply that Pace cut Slausen because of Sitton.) Hasn't ended up hurting the team.

All in all, I think the Marshall move hasn't worked out, the Forte-Bennett-Slausen moves have worked out for various reasons. Doesn't mean the moves were the right moves, just that in the crazy world of the NFL (injuries (Long/Sitton/Miller/Langford/Carey), injuries to other players on the team (Cutler/Hoyer/Long/Sitton, and/or straight out bad luck (White)) 3 of them haven't hurt the Bears as much as I thought.

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motm
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Looking back... Dec 15, 2016 16:47:03 GMT -6

Post by motm on Dec 15, 2016 16:47:03 GMT -6

Dec 15, 2016 16:26:10 GMT -6 hawkeye21 said:

Would the Bears have done anything even if they were competitive other then give us some entertainment? Most likely it would have been a losing season of 7 totals wins at the most. Forte's injury does matter because they are telling signs of an aging RB.

The goal for Pace is to build a solid team that can contend for the SB. Keeping older players from the past regime does not always help, especially when the rest of the team is so weak. Those older players take up cap space and roster space. The Bears may have a luxury with cap space but they do not with roster space. You can only have 53 players and that makes it hard to develop a younger team when you're keeping the older players. Once those older players are done then what do you have left? I think Pace decided to start with a clean slate and start his team from scratch as best he could.

"Would the Bears have done anything even if they were competitive other then give us some entertainment?"

Who knows. The Lions are leading the division so that must say something.

"Most likely it would have been a losing season of 7 totals wins at the most."

It could of been or it could of been much more. Having a healthy Jeffery and Marshall here could of gave us 2-3 more wins. Titans and Lions game was very winnable. Colts game was very winnable.

"Forte's injury does matter because they are telling signs of an aging RB."

Forte already played 13 games this season. Saying that aging is the reason he got the injury isn't a great excuse. Its football. Players get hurt. AP got hurt but was that on him?

"The goal for Pace is to build a solid team that can contend for the SB."

So that means getting rid of productive players? We have 2 great 30 year old players in Sitton and Freeman. You think they're the future of this team?

Keeping older players from the past regime does not always help, especially when the rest of the team is so weak. Those older players take up cap space and roster space. The Bears may have a luxury with cap space but they do not with roster space

Why is the team so weak? Getting rid of productive players does that too you. We fixed the defense at the cost of offense. How many of our players are even going to be here next year? Defense is fine besides secondary but our offense isn't. Cap space is useless when you don't spend it.

"You can only have 53 players and that makes it hard to develop a younger team when you're keeping the older players. Once those older players are done then what do you have left?"

Why are we keeping Sitton and Freeman? Both ain't the future here. You know why? Both are great players who can mentor our rookies.

"I think Pace decided to start with a clean slate and start his team from scratch as best he could."

Besides for his first offseason which to be honest was awful, he has done a much better job in year 2. Now if that continues in year 3 we should start seeing what this team should already be. A competitive team fighting for being even.

This is the NFL. You don't get 5+ years to build a team. We're going to have to see some growth in the 2017 season if we are to get out of this dark age.

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Last Edit: Dec 15, 2016 16:48:31 GMT -6 by motm

hawkeye21
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Looking back... Dec 15, 2016 16:56:06 GMT -6

Post by hawkeye21 on Dec 15, 2016 16:56:06 GMT -6

Dec 15, 2016 16:47:03 GMT -6 motm said:

Dec 15, 2016 16:26:10 GMT -6 hawkeye21 said:

Would the Bears have done anything even if they were competitive other then give us some entertainment? Most likely it would have been a losing season of 7 totals wins at the most. Forte's injury does matter because they are telling signs of an aging RB.

The goal for Pace is to build a solid team that can contend for the SB. Keeping older players from the past regime does not always help, especially when the rest of the team is so weak. Those older players take up cap space and roster space. The Bears may have a luxury with cap space but they do not with roster space. You can only have 53 players and that makes it hard to develop a younger team when you're keeping the older players. Once those older players are done then what do you have left? I think Pace decided to start with a clean slate and start his team from scratch as best he could.

"Would the Bears have done anything even if they were competitive other then give us some entertainment?"

Who knows. The Lions are leading the division so that must say something.

"Most likely it would have been a losing season of 7 totals wins at the most."

It could of been or it could of been much more. Having a healthy Jeffery and Marshall here could of gave us 2-3 more wins. Titans and Lions game was very winnable. Colts game was very winnable.

"Forte's injury does matter because they are telling signs of an aging RB."

Forte already played 13 games this season. Saying that aging is the reason he got the injury isn't a great excuse. Its football. Players get hurt. AP got hurt but was that on him?

"The goal for Pace is to build a solid team that can contend for the SB."

So that means getting rid of productive players? We have 2 great 30 year old players in Sitton and Freeman. You think they're the future of this team?

Keeping older players from the past regime does not always help, especially when the rest of the team is so weak. Those older players take up cap space and roster space. The Bears may have a luxury with cap space but they do not with roster space

Why is the team so weak? Getting rid of productive players does that too you. We fixed the defense at the cost of offense. How many of our players are even going to be here next year? Defense is fine besides secondary but our offense isn't. Cap space is useless when you don't spend it.

"You can only have 53 players and that makes it hard to develop a younger team when you're keeping the older players. Once those older players are done then what do you have left?"

Why are we keeping Sitton and Freeman? Both ain't the future here. You know why? Both are great players who can mentor our rookies.

"I think Pace decided to start with a clean slate and start his team from scratch as best he could."

Besides for his first offseason which to be honest was awful, he has done a much better job in year 2. Now if that continues in year 3 we should start seeing what this team should already be. A competitive team fighting for being even.

This is the NFL. You don't get 5+ years to build a team. We're going to have to see some growth in the 2017 season if we are to get out of this dark age.

Forte has been injured the majority of the season. He's just been playing through it. He will be 32 next year. Do you want that on your team when you trying to get younger?

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riczaj01
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Looking back... Dec 15, 2016 17:21:02 GMT -6 butkus3595 and MartianBearsFan like this

Post by riczaj01 on Dec 15, 2016 17:21:02 GMT -6

That NYJ's OL started strong, but it drug the team down along w/Fitzpatrick. The Bears OL was going to be better, and it was...vastly.

Forte and Howard would have been a force out there, and would have been a more reliable qb outlet then any other rb. He was definitely better then Langford and Carey but the past is the past and thank God the Bears didn't go w/those to and hit a grand slam in Howard.

Bennett has actually been dealing w/a ankle or leg injury for about 6 weeks also, but ya it's brady gronk and then whoever the def leaves open on any given day. Last I had heard they were wanting to re sign him.

Marshal, that's 2 years removed now and it was more then the locker room issue w/him imo.

Slauson would have been better then Lawsen and Kush, but the Bears lucked out in getting Sitton, and no way they could guess that Grassu would be lost for the season. The problem was w/the 2 guys they originally brought in weren't as good as him.

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motm
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Looking back... Dec 15, 2016 17:24:19 GMT -6

Post by motm on Dec 15, 2016 17:24:19 GMT -6

Dec 15, 2016 16:56:06 GMT -6 hawkeye21 said:

Dec 15, 2016 16:47:03 GMT -6 motm said:

"Would the Bears have done anything even if they were competitive other then give us some entertainment?"

Who knows. The Lions are leading the division so that must say something.

"Most likely it would have been a losing season of 7 totals wins at the most."

It could of been or it could of been much more. Having a healthy Jeffery and Marshall here could of gave us 2-3 more wins. Titans and Lions game was very winnable. Colts game was very winnable.

"Forte's injury does matter because they are telling signs of an aging RB."

Forte already played 13 games this season. Saying that aging is the reason he got the injury isn't a great excuse. Its football. Players get hurt. AP got hurt but was that on him?

"The goal for Pace is to build a solid team that can contend for the SB."

So that means getting rid of productive players? We have 2 great 30 year old players in Sitton and Freeman. You think they're the future of this team?

Keeping older players from the past regime does not always help, especially when the rest of the team is so weak. Those older players take up cap space and roster space. The Bears may have a luxury with cap space but they do not with roster space

Why is the team so weak? Getting rid of productive players does that too you. We fixed the defense at the cost of offense. How many of our players are even going to be here next year? Defense is fine besides secondary but our offense isn't. Cap space is useless when you don't spend it.

"You can only have 53 players and that makes it hard to develop a younger team when you're keeping the older players. Once those older players are done then what do you have left?"

Why are we keeping Sitton and Freeman? Both ain't the future here. You know why? Both are great players who can mentor our rookies.

"I think Pace decided to start with a clean slate and start his team from scratch as best he could."

Besides for his first offseason which to be honest was awful, he has done a much better job in year 2. Now if that continues in year 3 we should start seeing what this team should already be. A competitive team fighting for being even.

This is the NFL. You don't get 5+ years to build a team. We're going to have to see some growth in the 2017 season if we are to get out of this dark age.

Forte has been injured the majority of the season. He's just been playing through it. He will be 32 next year. Do you want that on your team when you trying to get younger?

AJ was hurt the majority of the season. So was Sitton. Both of which played through it. I don't understand your point... This is Football, stuff like this happens. Doesn't make them any less reliable...

So you rather the team have less talent so you can scream out "younger team"? Great teams have a mix of both Vets and Rookies.

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Last Edit: Dec 15, 2016 17:24:46 GMT -6 by motm

blueshoes
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Looking back... Dec 15, 2016 18:52:20 GMT -6 JABF, butkus3595, and 1 more like this

Post by blueshoes on Dec 15, 2016 18:52:20 GMT -6

I was always happy with what I saw from BMarsh - 1000yds seasons ain't nothin to sneeze at .
I was mostly happy with what I saw from The Bk Unicorn on the field - off the field he seemed to not really care much about winning .
Mostly happy with Slauson's efforts .
Same with Forte but his age as a RB made signing him too risky .

In short - I wish Bmarsh and the Unicorn were still here cuz we sure could use them .

The other 2 would have been ok - but looking for better is the rt move .

The coaches are experienced . That doesn't automatically = " good " but it doesn't = bad either. We're rebuilding - I bet the wins would have been there with better talent and less injuries .

Pace gets a B- so far imo . He still has time to elevate his game .

Only time will tell with all of this ... it was gonna take time anyways , but if this team isn't 8-8 next year then somethings off .

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hawkeye21
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Looking back... Dec 16, 2016 8:08:43 GMT -6

Post by hawkeye21 on Dec 16, 2016 8:08:43 GMT -6

Dec 15, 2016 17:24:19 GMT -6 motm said:

Dec 15, 2016 16:56:06 GMT -6 hawkeye21 said:

Forte has been injured the majority of the season. He's just been playing through it. He will be 32 next year. Do you want that on your team when you trying to get younger?

AJ was hurt the majority of the season. So was Sitton. Both of which played through it. I don't understand your point... This is Football, stuff like this happens. Doesn't make them any less reliable...

So you rather the team have less talent so you can scream out "younger team"? Great teams have a mix of both Vets and Rookies.

Just pretend you are managing the team and trying to rebuild it. Do you want to keep your aging players, some of which have been a problem, or do you want to start fresh with your own players? Forte and Sitton are the only two the were solid, team first players in my opinion so I could see keeping them. Looking at the history of aging RBs in the NFL it did make sense to move on from Forte. The Sitton deal is still a head scratcher to me but it worked out just fine. Looking at how all those players are doing this season I don't think they missed out on anything and I think they are actually closer to building the team they want.

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Post by motm on Dec 15, 2016 16:17:40 GMT -6

Post by hawkeye21 on Dec 15, 2016 16:26:10 GMT -6

Post by JABF on Dec 15, 2016 16:28:57 GMT -6

Post by brasilbear on Dec 15, 2016 16:29:38 GMT -6

Post by motm on Dec 15, 2016 16:47:03 GMT -6

Post by hawkeye21 on Dec 15, 2016 16:56:06 GMT -6

Post by riczaj01 on Dec 15, 2016 17:21:02 GMT -6

Post by motm on Dec 15, 2016 17:24:19 GMT -6

Post by blueshoes on Dec 15, 2016 18:52:20 GMT -6

Post by hawkeye21 on Dec 16, 2016 8:08:43 GMT -6