At this point in time who the hell knows what they'll do. Simply releasing him is a stupid is as stupid does move because he's the best QB we currently have on the roster. I really don't give a rip about how John Fox feels about him I'm more concerned about how Cutler feels about continuing to play under Fox. Fox has done nothing but poison the well for Pace.
One of the primary reasons the market for Cutler is lagging right is because of his shoulder injury and the other is the game Fox played last fall in which he made it clear he preferred Hoyer over Cutler. How's that for some astute personnel evaluation coming from the same guy who told Elway he was gonna start Osweiler in 2015 after Manning had lost the Super Bowl.
Elway said no you're not and we ended up with Fox messing up stuff in Chicago instead.
There's no rush here. No need at all to be desperate about a QB at the moment and plenty of time to let things play out. If Pace actually means it when he says all things are on the table including Cutler then to me it's a sign he's at least approaching it in an intelligent fashion despite being undermined by Fox.
As long as teams feel Cutler will be released they have no motivation to make a trade for him and assume his contract. Pace needs to counter that and Fox's lobbying in the media for bringing Hoyer back even though IMHO that would surely speed his being fired eventually. We'll be lucky to even manage an 8-8 season in 2018 with Cutler and AJ. Without them I see little chance of that.
If there is still a chance they can come to an agreement with AJ then that should be prioritized until it's either done or he's lost in FA. Then carry this QB thing along for a bit to see where it leads. Nothing absolutely has to be settled before then.
Talk that Garopplo is off the market is just that. IMHO Belicheat is pulling an old "take away" technique to ratchet up the offers he's getting. He wants a 1st round pick and he wants to see who'll jump and how high. The best way to do that is to first create the demand for something, see whose bidding and how much, then pull the item off the market which usually leads to higher bids in order to bring the item back on the market. Every good salesman on the planet has used this at one time or another and it usually works.
This decision is one Pace can't get wrong and the only thing that would justify releasing Cutler outright is that he has a far better option on the roster ready to take over now. Cousins will be pricier than Garoppolo and will ask for higher guarantees than Cutler got so it's doubtful ownership would bless that deal. Garoppolo is next and no matter what's been reported it's not a done deal yet. Anything is for sale for the right price.
Glennon is not an upgrade and would likely be as costly as Cutler plus we'd be back in the guaranteed money situation again for a guy who TB passed over as their starter in favor of Winston. If we're gonna pay for a backup I'll take Tom Brady's backup over Jameis Winston's any day. If we spend a top draft pick on a QB then Pace better be damn sure he's the right guy because again we'll have somewhere around $30 mil guaranteed tied up in him and this is not seen as a top QB class with multiple top ten caliber prospects. Making desperation grabs under these conditions tend to end up becoming huge mistakes.
I'm in favor of sticking with known quantities for now which includes Cutler if that's what it comes down to because we can't find a vet upgrade. Pace said it best when he told the media it's easier to recover from passing on someone you should have signed or drafted than it is from having signed or drafted the wrong guy and end up with tens of millions tied up in him you can't get out from under. Isn't that what Houston did with Osweiler?
In fact isn't that the same gripe some Bears fans have had with Cutler for the last three years? So....you want to do that all over again? Just asking.
Soul, to be perfectly honest, yes, yes I do. I just can't stand Jay anymore. Like you said, well is poisoned. Its like you have a wife and you don't really like her anymore. You can't be affraid to ditch her because the next one could be worse. We need to try to find better. And if we fail, keep on trying. Lyrics, Aaliyah: And if at first you don"t succeed Then dust yourself off and try again
Well then good luck with that approach Alex. The long term Bears history of being correct about QB acquisitions whether drafted, signed as UFAs, or traded for is not good. You and others may complain about Cutler and say you can't take it anymore but standing against that is that the fact that he is still the best QB we've had since Sid Luckman whose just played on some very bad Bears teams with little support for much of his career.
When I say the well has been poisoned I'm talking about the trade market for Cutler. Fox did that last fall and it's come home to roost now and yet he still keeps undermining Pace in the process. He's really the poison to this team not Cutler but Cutler has become so unpopular many refuse to see it. Whose been behind ridding this team of so many of it's top offensive players? It wasn't you or me was it?
I've made it very clear I have no attachment to Cutler that keeps me from agreeing to move on from him provided that move is a positive one. Lacking that we're more than likely headed down similar paths to those we traveled before Cutler arrived and if that happens this team really can kiss me goodbye. It's been hard enough to stand by watching how completely chaotic and mismanaged they've become lately and one more stupid move will be the last nail in the coffin.
If they plan to replace Cutler they need to make it count with an upgrade or I have no desire to watch them mess up for another three or four years trying to get out from under even more stupid mistakes.
Soul, to be perfectly honest, yes, yes I do. I just can't stand Jay anymore. Like you said, well is poisoned. Its like you have a wife and you don't really like her anymore. You can't be affraid to ditch her because the next one could be worse. We need to try to find better. And if we fail, keep on trying. Lyrics, Aaliyah: And if at first you don"t succeed Then dust yourself off and try again
Well then good luck with that approach Alex. The long term Bears history of being correct about QB acquisitions whether drafted, signed as UFAs, or traded for is not good. You and others may complain about Cutler and say you can't take it anymore but standing against that is that the fact that he is still the best QB we've had since Sid Luckman whose just played on some very bad Bears teams with little support for much of his career.
When I say the well has been poisoned I'm talking about the trade market for Cutler. Fox did that last fall and it's come home to roost now and yet he still keeps undermining Pace in the process. He's really the poison to this team not Cutler but Cutler has become so unpopular many refuse to see it. Whose been behind ridding this team of so many of it's top offensive players? It wasn't you or me was it?
I've made it very clear I have no attachment to Cutler that keeps me from agreeing to move on from him provided that move is a positive one. Lacking that we're more than likely headed down similar paths to those we traveled before Cutler arrived and if that happens this team really can kiss me goodbye. It's been hard enough to stand by watching how completely chaotic and mismanaged they've become lately and one more stupid move will be the last nail in the coffin.
If they plan to replace Cutler they need to make it count with an upgrade or I have no desire to watch them mess up for another three or four years trying to get out from under even more stupid mistakes.
Tell me Soul, how many QB 1st round picks have we seen in Chicago last 20y?
Well then good luck with that approach Alex. The long term Bears history of being correct about QB acquisitions whether drafted, signed as UFAs, or traded for is not good. You and others may complain about Cutler and say you can't take it anymore but standing against that is that the fact that he is still the best QB we've had since Sid Luckman whose just played on some very bad Bears teams with little support for much of his career.
When I say the well has been poisoned I'm talking about the trade market for Cutler. Fox did that last fall and it's come home to roost now and yet he still keeps undermining Pace in the process. He's really the poison to this team not Cutler but Cutler has become so unpopular many refuse to see it. Whose been behind ridding this team of so many of it's top offensive players? It wasn't you or me was it?
I've made it very clear I have no attachment to Cutler that keeps me from agreeing to move on from him provided that move is a positive one. Lacking that we're more than likely headed down similar paths to those we traveled before Cutler arrived and if that happens this team really can kiss me goodbye. It's been hard enough to stand by watching how completely chaotic and mismanaged they've become lately and one more stupid move will be the last nail in the coffin.
If they plan to replace Cutler they need to make it count with an upgrade or I have no desire to watch them mess up for another three or four years trying to get out from under even more stupid mistakes.
Tell me Soul, how many QB 1st round picks have we seen in Chicago last 20y?
We haven't drafted ANY under Ryan Pace. We haven't even tried to spend a serious draft pick on a QB since 2003 (Grossman). Before that it was 1999 (McNown). Before that it was 1987 (Jim Harbough). This is 2017!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Time to get in the game and TRY to draft one in the top round or two.
Soul, to be perfectly honest, yes, yes I do. I just can't stand Jay anymore. Like you said, well is poisoned. Its like you have a wife and you don't really like her anymore. You can't be affraid to ditch her because the next one could be worse. We need to try to find better. And if we fail, keep on trying. Lyrics, Aaliyah: And if at first you don"t succeed Then dust yourself off and try again
I'm done with Cutler (saying this as someone who defended him over and over through the years) and Pace is clearly too. If he can squeeze a late round pick out of someone, great. If not, then just release him.
It's like an overdue divorce as you said. Expensive and painful and awkward but ultimately worth it. Cut your losses and move on, hopefully learning something for the "next one".
That's fine with me too as long as it fixes the problem but what in their past tells you that it can be in this market? The best possible upgrades will only be available via trade it seems and even that isn't certain. If he is released Cutler may well become the best UFA QB on the market. And the draft has three or maybe four prospects none of whom truly rate a top ten ranking and who most feel won't be ready to start this year at a minimum.
So review the options for me if you will. Who would you go with? What's the plan for 2017? Will we need a "bridge QB" and if so who? Hoyer is a fairly cheap option and also pretty much useless as a starter who can win. I might be in favor of that if it assures Fox's departure even quicker. Barkley? Shaw? Glennon with enough guaranteed money to keep him here for two or three years before we could move on again?
You know the funny thing about marital divorces is that they aren't the same as an NFL divorce so that's a very poor comparison. I've been divorced twice and decided I really don't need to have a wife to survive in life quite well. But in the NFL you will need a starting QB each and every game so there is no going through life single without being married to one. So if we divorce from Cutler whose our next bride to be? When we find one who won't be as bad or worse then you all can invite me to the wedding OK?
Well then good luck with that approach Alex. The long term Bears history of being correct about QB acquisitions whether drafted, signed as UFAs, or traded for is not good. You and others may complain about Cutler and say you can't take it anymore but standing against that is that the fact that he is still the best QB we've had since Sid Luckman whose just played on some very bad Bears teams with little support for much of his career.
When I say the well has been poisoned I'm talking about the trade market for Cutler. Fox did that last fall and it's come home to roost now and yet he still keeps undermining Pace in the process. He's really the poison to this team not Cutler but Cutler has become so unpopular many refuse to see it. Whose been behind ridding this team of so many of it's top offensive players? It wasn't you or me was it?
I've made it very clear I have no attachment to Cutler that keeps me from agreeing to move on from him provided that move is a positive one. Lacking that we're more than likely headed down similar paths to those we traveled before Cutler arrived and if that happens this team really can kiss me goodbye. It's been hard enough to stand by watching how completely chaotic and mismanaged they've become lately and one more stupid move will be the last nail in the coffin.
If they plan to replace Cutler they need to make it count with an upgrade or I have no desire to watch them mess up for another three or four years trying to get out from under even more stupid mistakes.
Tell me Soul, how many QB 1st round picks have we seen in Chicago last 20y?
In 1997 we gave up our 1st for Rick Mirer who was the #2 overall pick in the 1993 draft by Seattle. He was a complete failure and because of that we spent the #12 overall pick in the 1999 draft on Cade McNown who was also a complete failure. After struggling for several years playing QB derby with guys who shouldn't even have been NFL starters period in 2003 we used another 1st round pick on Rex Grossman who managed to last 6 seasons but only played the full 16 games in one due to injuries or incompetence. Take your pick. So that was three 1st round picks expended over 7 offseasons and we got one year out of all of them good enough to make it to a Super Bowl.
In 2009 we sent two 1st round picks to Denver for Cutler who of all of the above has been far better by a long shot but still not good enough to win a championship although he did come close in 2010. Though 2012 under Lovie and the OC of the day he'd won 61% of his starts (34-22) and then the wheels began to fall off under Trestman and Fox leaving him 51/51 now I believe. So are you telling me that the shitty teams we've fielded for the last four years aren't in many ways responsible for this? This is a guy whose won over 80% of his starts when the defense held the other guys to 20 points or less so would it be a fairly logical conclusion to say that playing behind the two worst defenses in Bears history in 2013-14 he didn't stand a whole lot of chance in winning much?
So those are all of the 1st round picks we used on QBs over the past 20 years like you asked and the only one whose even come close to justifying what we paid for him is Cutler. That's how shitty it's been Alex and if that's where we're headed again call me when the next bad dream is over because I'm not gonna share in it.
Look, I think for Jay Cutler's sake the best thing would be for him to play for another team and maybe prove he isn't as bad as many Bears fans believe he is. But moving on isn't something we should do just to make it even worse only because you and a whole lot of others are sick of Cutler. I'm a lot sicker of John Fox, Ted Phillips, and the McCaskeys but they're all still here and won't be going anywhere. So nothing has changed and replacing Cutler won't change much either. That I'm sure of.
Tell me Soul, how many QB 1st round picks have we seen in Chicago last 20y?
In 1997 we gave up our 1st for Rick Mirer who was the #2 overall pick in the 1993 draft by Seattle. He was a complete failure and because of that we spent the #12 overall pick in the 1999 draft on Cade McNown who was also a complete failure. After struggling for several years playing QB derby with guys who shouldn't even have been NFL starters period in 2003 we used another 1st round pick on Rex Grossman who managed to last 6 seasons but only played the full 16 games in one due to injuries or incompetence. Take your pick. So that was three 1st round picks expended over 7 offseasons and we got one year out of all of them good enough to make it to a Super Bowl.
In 2009 we sent two 1st round picks to Denver for Cutler who of all of the above has been far better by a long shot but still not good enough to win a championship although he did come close in 2010. Though 2012 under Lovie and the OC of the day he'd won 61% of his starts (34-22) and then the wheels began to fall off under Trestman and Fox leaving him 51/51 now I believe. So are you telling me that the shitty teams we've fielded for the last four years aren't in many ways responsible for this? This is a guy whose won over 80% of his starts when the defense held the other guys to 20 points or less so would it be a fairly logical conclusion to say that playing behind the two worst defenses in Bears history in 2013-14 he didn't stand a whole lot of chance in winning much?
So those are all of the 1st round picks we used on QBs over the past 20 years like you asked and the only one whose even come close to justifying what we paid for him is Cutler. That's how shitty it's been Alex and if that's where we're headed again call me when the next bad dream is over because I'm not gonna share in it.
Look, I think for Jay Cutler's sake the best thing would be for him to play for another team and maybe prove he isn't as bad as many Bears fans believe he is. But moving on isn't something we should do just to make it even worse only because you and a whole lot of others are sick of Cutler. I'm a lot sicker of John Fox, Ted Phillips, and the McCaskeys but they're all still here and won't be going anywhere. So nothing has changed and replacing Cutler won't change much either. That I'm sure of.
Well, if you ask me im all for ditching 1. Phillips, 2.McCaskeys, 3.Fox