+1 brasil. And now we will spend the next 2-3 years drafting OL and the defense pipeline will suffer. There is no free lunch, everything must be paid for sooner or later.
Defensive pipeline still looks good. Your core is still young to mid aged, not really old. Will need OLB ILB CB and DE help in those 2-3 years but all of that is gotten even w/drafting OL early.
Jackson, Gipson, Johnson, Smith, Goldman, RRH, Nichols are all young. Hicks/Mack/Fuller don't need replaced next year, probably not the year after that.
The team has all but a 4th next year and should have all their picks the year after that. QB/LT/RT/OG dont all have to be early picks, nor do all the def picks. QB/OT's/OLB/CB all should be early picks in the next 3years. But w/3 1sts, 3 2nds and 3 3rds that's all doable w/some extras thrown in like OG/ILB/DE/WR
...If anything we should be bitching about not going after Claypool or one of the OT's. But of the group of OT's in the 2nd-3rd rounds none are starting. All buried on the depth chart, and at least one not even at OT. The Bears might have dodged a bullet, or judged correctly...
If that is true (and I have reason to doubt that) then posters who claim that Pace should have drafted an OT in a "strong OT class" really shouldn't post about the draft anymore.
Nothing gets me madder than the draftniks. Pure crap shoot after the "sure things" and even then...But lets make presumptive declarations before the draft and perfect hindsight 20-20 a year or two later. SMH.
Still could be a strong OT class, but no way of knowing until 3-4 years down the line; but ya it doesn't look good. Deils advocate here, just b/c they aren't starting on their teams doesn't mean they wouldn't at leas beat out Leno/Massie does it. Well it might, hard to know which one could play in this system and do it better.
ya there is no way of knowing before or even a year or 2 after a draft what the draft really was.
(1) Believe that drafting anything except a LT early (like first round early) is criminally wrong. (2) That since we tried drafting the best college center once, we shouldn't try again (3) Consider draft picks other teams used on players that Pace signed in FA to be picks invested by the Bears (4) Consider a line that goes FA-FA-2nd-2nd-7th to indicate an investment of resources (pre-Daniels injury. Its FA-FA-2nd-UDFA-7th if you go with Bars or Coward) (5) Believe that outside of maybe Edge, every other position can be addressed late in the draft an an after thought.
and then we wonder why the OL struggles. I know there have always been other priorities but the bill comes due eventually.
Unless these people work in scouting/draft board building and have an actual say in the draft, none of 1-5 have anything to do w/why the OL is struggling. I know it's hard to believe, but NFL teams don't give 2 shits about the fans opinion unless it's somehow costing them viewership.
The OL is struggling b/c Pace comes from a system that believes in interior OL > exterior OL, and a HC that hasn't apparently tried to set him straight as to why the system he runs needs to be the opposite.
People need to remember that Leno got his extension bc of how well he played in his contract year, got a pro bowl invite, and at the time was paid around 15th for LT's; and his contract is now closer to 17th-20th. That is probably dead on to a little low for his actual play. He's still a middle of the road LT.
Massie never made sense though, that's a top 10-12 contract for a RT who's play is replaceable at best. That's money poorly spent, and IMO he only got that b/c he was Longs buddy and the team wanted to keep him happy(fat lot of good that did them).
Bonus, both Leno/Massie are a cap savings of 2 to 6 or8 mil depending on when they cut them. You get 16mil from those 2 bums and you can likely get a RT and RG upgrade in FA and it might not even cost you all 16mil; and that means LT/QB/ILB in rounds 1-3 instead of LT/RT/RG/ILB in rounds 1-3 and 5. Opens the draft greatly for bpa.
My 1-5 were more directed at fans who don't have the slightest idea what they are talking about. You want good players you draft them and you draft them early because with a few exceptions that prove the rule, higher in the draft = better players.
Pace inherited an OL that was on its last legs or trending downward and IMO he has not sunk into it the resources he has needed to. 2 seconds and a 7th is what he has spent. As a result he's been forced to go into FA for the entire right side of the line. Many of us here have pleaded at draft time to draft prospect OL (and by prospect we didn't mean 6th and 7rd afterthoughts but 2nds, 3rds and 4th. But nooooooooooo...cover over the holes with FA and hope Long gets healthy.
Now the Bears are going to have to try and rebuild an OL while adding a rookie QB to the mix. But we'll still have the arguments about don't draft G/C/RT early and since Pace won't have a high pick, don't draft a LT either. You can fix an OL that has a hole using FA but can you rebuild a whole OL? Guess we'll find out.
OK. Rant over....I'll go back to self-soothing with coffee and twitter videos.
(1) Believe that drafting anything except a LT early (like first round early) is criminally wrong. (2) That since we tried drafting the best college center once, we shouldn't try again (3) Consider draft picks other teams used on players that Pace signed in FA to be picks invested by the Bears (4) Consider a line that goes FA-FA-2nd-2nd-7th to indicate an investment of resources (pre-Daniels injury. Its FA-FA-2nd-UDFA-7th if you go with Bars or Coward) (5) Believe that outside of maybe Edge, every other position can be addressed late in the draft an an after thought.
and then we wonder why the OL struggles. I know there have always been other priorities but the bill comes due eventually.
Speaking only of interior OL for a moment:
Whitehair and Daniels were both 2nd rounders. The former was a rookie standout who went to the PB in 2018 and the latter seemed to be coming into his own in year 3 before injury. Ifedi (yes, I know Seattle drafted him originally) was a 1st round OT who is better as a G than a T and was a priority FA this offseason. That does constitute a substantial "investment" in my book. Unfortunately, Daniels got hurt and Whitehair isn't playing up the level we have seen in prior seasons.
Don't think anyone said its "criminally wrong" to draft a Guard high in the 1st round. It simply doesn't happen very often for the same reasons that you don't see RBs get drafted high in the 1st very often. There's only been 2 OGs drafted top-10 I can recall over the last 10 years or so--Scherff and Nelson and the latter player was almost universally considered a generational, can't miss type of prospect. Most years there simply aren't any OGs who are so dominant and so clearly BPA to justify taking one that high. Look across the 32 NFL rosters and you will see lots of day 2, day 3, and even UDFA players manning the G-C-G positions. It's pretty common actually.
I will agree that Pace has invested relatively little in the OT positions. And that has been compounded by the fact that Massie was just a so-so player to begin with who is now over 30 and Leno has really fallen off a cliff in 2019-20 since getting that big contract. Yep, couldn't agree more than drafting an OL -- particularly an OT -- in the 1st or 2nd round of 2021 seems like a worthy pick (assuming the prospect is of course).
This whole discussion (ALL of the OL) hearkens back to Pace's high profile draft and FA misses which have sapped the team of both cap space and draft picks as we have had to re-draft positions, trade away picks, and spend extra FA money due to too many key misses by Pace.
...If anything we should be bitching about not going after Claypool or one of the OT's. But of the group of OT's in the 2nd-3rd rounds none are starting. All buried on the depth chart, and at least one not even at OT. The Bears might have dodged a bullet, or judged correctly...
If that is true (and I have reason to doubt that) then posters who claim that Pace should have drafted an OT in a "strong OT class" really shouldn't post about the draft anymore.
Nothing gets me madder than the draftniks. Pure crap shoot after the "sure things" and even then...But lets make presumptive declarations before the draft and perfect hindsight 20-20 a year or two later. SMH.
Well, you can't really bitch about the OL and "lack of investment" and then say Pace was correct not to draft one, can you?
Let's make this clear: Last year was considered a very strong draft for OTs and the proof is in the pudding. There were 6 taken in the 1st round alone so that wasn't just "the draftniks" assessment. It was obviously the assessment of lots of GMs and Scouting departments too.
The fact that the 2nd & 3rd rounders aren't yet starting doesn't mean very much, especially only 6 weeks into a season that had virtually no offseason rookie program and no preseason games. Cole Kmet was one of our 2nd round picks and he's not starting either (#3 TE currently).
Lemme see if I have this right....you're telling people they "shouldn't post about the draft" and "don't have the slightest idea what they are talking about" (both verbatim quotes) while you yourself are claiming that the fact no 2nd or 3rd round rookie OT is starting yet proves it. OMG you can't be serious. It's been only 6 games in a year with no offseason program and it takes 2-3 years minimum to fairly judge a draft class anyway.
Besides, I was wanting to draft an OT to get one in the pipeline for the future--as Ric and I pointed out, both our current starting Tackles are on un-cuttable contracts this season so they weren't going anywhere until at least 2021.
We have NOTHING in the pipeline at OT beyond Leno and Massie right now. Maybe Coward if he gets a look at RT (he's a UDFA defensive convert) or Simmons (who's a 7th round rookie this year on the PS). That's it. Our swing tackle is a failed former Packer draftee with a long injury history who's on a short term deal. We have no one ready to take over one of the starting OT positions for 2021 right now.
While I agree, the draft is fickle and no GM can hit on every selection, I certainly wouldn't call it a "pure crap shoot". If that were true....i.e., if it was just random, then 7th round picks would become starters just as often as 1st rounders and that obviously is false. There's some dumb luck involved sure, but it isn't a crap shoot. Teams wouldn't spend millions every year on scouts and GMs if it were.
I trust a coach like McDermott's judgment, here. There has to be good reason to bench and cut a guy you just extended this offseason, especially when your OL isn't that great.
I cannot stress how many times I watched this play to try to figure out why Coward suddenly stopped and turned to block linebacker Tahir Whitehead, who Kmet was inches away from blocking. It looks like Kmet got his assignment right, but Coward briefly hesitated while pulling as to if he was supposed to block No. 52 (Whitehead) or No. 54 (Shaq Thompson). I wonder if this might have something to do with Coward never having played on the left side of the line before.
I cannot stress how many times I watched this play to try to figure out why Coward suddenly stopped and turned to block linebacker Tahir Whitehead, who Kmet was inches away from blocking. It looks like Kmet got his assignment right, but Coward briefly hesitated while pulling as to if he was supposed to block No. 52 (Whitehead) or No. 54 (Shaq Thompson). I wonder if this might have something to do with Coward never having played on the left side of the line before.
The Coward-DL-to-OL-conversion project looks like its running out of runway. This is his shot to nail down a starting job on the OL and if he can't get it done this season (and he didn't last year either), it's probably time to move on.
The Coward-DL-to-OL-conversion project looks like its running out of runway. This is his shot to nail down a starting job on the OL and if he can't get it done this season (and he didn't last year either), it's probably time to move on.
Yeah, we should definitely cut bait on him after that one play. I mean, what's taking so long for him, he's 25 years old and has been an OL for two whole years after playing D his whole life!? How dare we keep him around beyond 11 starts. This one play is indicative of everything of Coward represents and brings to the table.