Post by brasilbear on May 27, 2018 16:54:38 GMT -6
IMO the problem could have stopped at Trestman/Tucker but after the Trestman disaster (hiring an outside the box HC) the brain trust doubled down by going 180 degrees the other way to return to 'old school' coaching. A team that needed to retool/rebuild/whatever-word-you-want-to-use doesn't need an old school coach who prefers to play vets over rookies or lose close games to taking chances. It needs a coach who will play ceiling over floor, and look to use every advantage he has to win games, using them as teaching moments rather than cover-my-butt.
To give Fox credit because he changed the culture isn't even correct. Pace/Fox shipped out anyone considered a 'bad locker-room guy." Once they were gone what did he have to do? Oh yeah....win games. Black and white. Win games. Its the only thing that matters in the long and even in the short term. No one is going to look back on the Fox years and say "He did a great job of changing culture." Instead they are going to say "wow, Trestman won 13 games in 2 years and it took Fox 3 years. He sucked." and I'm going to stir in my rocking chair and say "Sonny, you have no idea."
I know I say to myself every time this topic comes up, but I'm done with Fox and discussing his ineptitude coaching tenure. Time to move on and hopefully I'm not ranting about Nagy in a few years.
Maybe off-topic but I keep thinking the move that broke the team's back was the GM and HC choice after they moved on from Angelo & Lovie. The team needed to make a move, but that point in team history was where the franchise just killed itself.
That was after the 2011 season.
It is now 2018 and we still are digging out of the hole. Let that one sink in for a minute. All these years later and we are only a 5-win team. John Fox takes some blame here, but the blame goes beyond 1 head coach here. The franchise just staggered from one bad move to another. It looks like the franchise may (and I mean "may" not is) finally turn around and start getting on track. We will see.
But why did it take so many years to get on the right track? Assuming we "are" on the right track now. This is bigger than just John Fox. He was just one factor, and not even the key factor, IMHO.
I can't disagree. For whatever reason Teddy Bears and GMcC settled on an inexperienced amateur GM because he was a former Bears scout and it would seem they were somehow comfortable with that. Emery's lack of experience and the first hint of arrogance shows when he disregards the advice he received, passed over Bruce Arians who was by far the stronger prospect, and hired Trestman instead.
Trestman long out of the NFL can't hire a capable staff and the slide into oblivion begins. There was a lot about Trestman we didn't know then but when you're trying to rebuild an aging team it seems to me that a more qualified NFL coach with current contacts from which to build a staff would have been a much smarter move and it's possible we might even have retained some of Lovies staff.
Because of that screw up THEN we reverse field and hire an experienced HC with contacts to build a decent staff but the wrong HC for a team badly in need of finding a way to build a modern day offense and Emery arrogance is replaced by Fox's. But again this article isn't so much about Fox's failures as it his comments that tend to indicate he will feel entitled to some credit for any success if and when it comes.
Much like Fisher if Fox had ended on a strong upstroke maybe both would be allowed that viewpoint but as it stands I can't see it.
Maybe off-topic but I keep thinking the move that broke the team's back was the GM and HC choice after they moved on from Angelo & Lovie. The team needed to make a move, but that point in team history was where the franchise just killed itself.
That was after the 2011 season.
It is now 2018 and we still are digging out of the hole. Let that one sink in for a minute. All these years later and we are only a 5-win team. John Fox takes some blame here, but the blame goes beyond 1 head coach here. The franchise just staggered from one bad move to another. It looks like the franchise may (and I mean "may" not is) finally turn around and start getting on track. We will see.
But why did it take so many years to get on the right track? Assuming we "are" on the right track now. This is bigger than just John Fox. He was just one factor, and not even the key factor, IMHO.
I can't disagree. For whatever reason Teddy Bears and GMcC settled on an inexperienced amateur GM because he was a former Bears scout and it would seem they were somehow comfortable with that. Emery's lack of experience and the first hint of arrogance shows when he disregards the advice he received, passed over Bruce Arians who was by far the stronger prospect, and hired Trestman instead.
Trestman long out of the NFL can't hire a capable staff and the slide into oblivion begins. There was a lot about Trestman we didn't know then but when you're trying to rebuild an aging team it seems to me that a more qualified NFL coach with current contacts from which to build a staff would have been a much smarter move and it's possible we might even have retained some of Lovies staff.
Because of that screw up THEN we reverse field and hire an experienced HC with contacts to build a decent staff but the wrong HC for a team badly in need of finding a way to build a modern day offense and Emery arrogance is replaced by Fox's. But again this article isn't so much about Fox's failures as it his comments that tend to indicate he will feel entitled to some credit for any success if and when it comes.
Much like Fisher if Fox had ended on a strong upstroke maybe both would be allowed that viewpoint but as it stands I can't see it.
Can't help myself, but its either yell at the bastketball refs on TV because they can't count steps or post about Fox.
Ironically, Fox would have been a good hire after Lovie. IMO the DEF wouldn't have fallen apart and he would have been able to reach out to the vets after Lovie was let go and possibly been a good influence on Emery. Marshall and Bennett might not have freaked out with Fox around. But after Trestman the team needed someone else. Its all speculation anyway at this point.
This kind of black and white thinking is so boring.
That and Fox is no longer part of this team anymore and nothing he does anymore is going to affect it. So how about people stop dragging his name through the mud everytime he gets mentioned in the news.
Maybe off-topic but I keep thinking the move that broke the team's back was the GM and HC choice after they moved on from Angelo & Lovie. The team needed to make a move, but that point in team history was where the franchise just killed itself.
That was after the 2011 season.
It is now 2018 and we still are digging out of the hole. Let that one sink in for a minute. All these years later and we are only a 5-win team. John Fox takes some blame here, but the blame goes beyond 1 head coach here. The franchise just staggered from one bad move to another. It looks like the franchise may (and I mean "may" not is) finally turn around and start getting on track. We will see.
But why did it take so many years to get on the right track? Assuming we "are" on the right track now. This is bigger than just John Fox. He was just one factor, and not even the key factor, IMHO.
I can't disagree. For whatever reason Teddy Bears and GMcC settled on an inexperienced amateur GM because he was a former Bears scout and it would seem they were somehow comfortable with that. Emery's lack of experience and the first hint of arrogance shows when he disregards the advice he received, passed over Bruce Arians who was by far the stronger prospect, and hired Trestman instead.
Trestman long out of the NFL can't hire a capable staff and the slide into oblivion begins. There was a lot about Trestman we didn't know then but when you're trying to rebuild an aging team it seems to me that a more qualified NFL coach with current contacts from which to build a staff would have been a much smarter move and it's possible we might even have retained some of Lovies staff.
Because of that screw up THEN we reverse field and hire an experienced HC with contacts to build a decent staff but the wrong HC for a team badly in need of finding a way to build a modern day offense and Emery arrogance is replaced by Fox's. But again this article isn't so much about Fox's failures as it his comments that tend to indicate he will feel entitled to some credit for any success if and when it comes.
Much like Fisher if Fox had ended on a strong upstroke maybe both would be allowed that viewpoint but as it stands I can't see it.
I agree about the coaching factor. No question we have had problems with coaching staffs going back years. We haven't had a complete solid staff since the 1980s. But the roster began losing talent under Angelo/Lovie after the SB year. It began there. They couldn't stop the bleeding. Emery not only failed to fix it. The roster talent got even worse. Pace in year 1 whiffed on players too.
This talent drain was worse than a failed coach.
We fired coaches. That is easy. Fixing a roster that has atrophied for years and years is a problem of greater magnitude. We are 7 or 8 years into the roster rebuild now - and counting.
Post by weneedmorelinemen on Jun 2, 2018 6:20:25 GMT -6
The team was a dumpster fire after the Trestman/ Tucker/ Emery debacle. Emery chose incredibly poorly with Trestman, but also with stacking the team with headcases like Ratliff, Marshall, and Bennett. Those kind of players do not succeed without strong coaches to keep them in line.
I know Fox did not win games for the Bears, but he and Pace did put out the dumpster fire. They did bring in Fangio not another Mel Tucker. Instead of continuing to swirl in the toilet like the Jets and the Browns seem destined to do, the Bears finally look like the have promise.
Maybe off-topic but I keep thinking the move that broke the team's back was the GM and HC choice after they moved on from Angelo & Lovie. The team needed to make a move, but that point in team history was where the franchise just killed itself.
That was after the 2011 season.
It is now 2018 and we still are digging out of the hole. Let that one sink in for a minute. All these years later and we are only a 5-win team. John Fox takes some blame here, but the blame goes beyond 1 head coach here. The franchise just staggered from one bad move to another. It looks like the franchise may (and I mean "may" not is) finally turn around and start getting on track. We will see.
But why did it take so many years to get on the right track? Assuming we "are" on the right track now. This is bigger than just John Fox. He was just one factor, and not even the key factor, IMHO.
You evolve or you get left in the dust , and once D's figure out how to stop RPO's then it will be time for something else . I hope they get that up at HH ... once and for all .
Maybe off-topic but I keep thinking the move that broke the team's back was the GM and HC choice after they moved on from Angelo & Lovie. The team needed to make a move, but that point in team history was where the franchise just killed itself.
That was after the 2011 season.
It is now 2018 and we still are digging out of the hole. Let that one sink in for a minute. All these years later and we are only a 5-win team. John Fox takes some blame here, but the blame goes beyond 1 head coach here. The franchise just staggered from one bad move to another. It looks like the franchise may (and I mean "may" not is) finally turn around and start getting on track. We will see.
But why did it take so many years to get on the right track? Assuming we "are" on the right track now. This is bigger than just John Fox. He was just one factor, and not even the key factor, IMHO.
You evolve or you get left in the dust , and once D's figure out how to stop RPO's then it will be time for something else . I hope they get that up at HH ... once and for all .
I do agree. Pace needs to provide a top-tier coaching staff, and then he, and our scouting department, need to feed the talent to the coaches. I think Pace has done pretty well recently doing this. And the coaches need to be ever evolving and refining. My gut feeling is that Nagy, over the years, will always have a diverse offense with a new and ever-evolving playbook. I don't think this will ever be a Loggains or Mike Tice type O.
I think all George McCaskey and Sweaty Teddy had to do, was to get out of Pace's way and let him run the team... you know, like a "real" GM does.
You evolve or you get left in the dust , and once D's figure out how to stop RPO's then it will be time for something else . I hope they get that up at HH ... once and for all .
I do agree. Pace needs to provide a top-tier coaching staff, and then he, and our scouting department, need to feed the talent to the coaches. I think Pace has done pretty well recently doing this. And the coaches need to be ever evolving and refining. My gut feeling is that Nagy, over the years, will always have a diverse offense with a new and ever-evolving playbook. I don't think this will ever be a Loggains or Mike Tice type O.
I think all George McCaskey and Sweaty Teddy had to do, was to get out of Pace's way and let him run the team... you know, like a "real" GM does.
I'm just hoping that the football Gods have decided we've suffered long enough and gave us a gem with Nagy etc . Our luck has to change someday and I'm hoping it's finally this year .
This kind of black and white thinking is so boring.
That and Fox is no longer part of this team anymore and nothing he does anymore is going to affect it. So how about people stop dragging his name through the mud everytime he gets mentioned in the news.
Nah. There's a whole lot of mud to clean up and Fox is a veritable sponge especially when he thinks he somehow deserves some credit for anything other than being the second worst HC in Bears history. He brought this one on himself.